Philip Adler, junior professor of Management at Georgia Tech, conducted by Maryland Farmers on March the sixth, 1996. And here we are at scope of management. Dr. Adler, thank you so much for joining us here today. We're looking forward to hearing your story. I'll stories begin at the beginning. 

So if you'd be so kind, sir. Thank you. Maryland. It's my pleasure to be here and to be able to, I guess relives things. My life, especially my Georgia Tech life, which is over half of my life. I was born in Cincinnati, Ohio, 1930. My father was also a date in Cincinnati, Ohio and my mother was from Paris, kentucky. That's where she was born. I Kevin from a family been in this country a long time. 

All four of my grandparents were here before 1890, and my mother's father fought in the Civil War and the Kentucky Confederacy is a very young teenager. 

So I go back a long time. My early schooling was elementary school. I went to a public high school known as well. 

It helps high school where? 

There's a six-year Public College Prep High School, one of the few like it anywhere in the United States. And the school produce very famous people. 

Unfortunately, I was not one of them, but out of it came such people as the current conductor of the Metropolitan Opera, Jimmy Levine, Tony triggered tennis. Farmer kept in the Davis Cup tennis team. And Doug McGregor, I think his last name, the producer, the bot TV series. 

So there were some very prominent people and the nature of the school was to cultivate individuals for college. Six-year prep. 

We had Latin forever and things of that nature, But we also had the opportunity to do a lot of work and radio and Speech and Drama. I was very interested in radio and that was going to be my career to be a radio announcer. 

So I studied radio. I had some interesting teachers outside you. 

Young, young people may not remember, but your own power was very famous actor who also went to high school. 

But his aunt, Helen Martin was somewhat of a tutor of mine outside of school and radio, so she had a lot more to work with her nephew them with may eat, but nevertheless, a good radio training, potty graduation from high school. I went to Ohio State University where I had planned to be on the track team. That was my attraction to Ohio State. 

You need to know, get much academic guidance but on that, but I was interested in being involved with athletics that Ohio State because it was very prominent in that regard, obviously still is. 

So I plan to be on the track team where I was at a quarter mile or well, I found that first tryouts, I wasn't out of the starting block and the rest of the guys around me were finished. 

Unfortunately, I was running with Mao Whitfield, who was a gold medal Olympus in the 400 meter or what they call of the quarter mile dash. 

So I gave up on that. 

And wrestling coach saw me says we get strong legs from running your only way, a 100 and less than 120, £1 entered 19, we need lightweight for a wrestling team. 

So that six, it has six footer who was under a 100 £21 probably in a wrestling team. 

So I became a wrestling remember the wrestling team for Iowa State? 

Hate to say wrestler because I was probably the worst member of that team that ever existed. 

But they gave me a varsity letters out of sympathy and I still pride myself on having tuberosity letters. State wrestling team. 

I had some prominent roommates, one of whom unfortunately just died this week was in the newspaper Vic, Jana wait, see when the Heisman trophy and 950 one was one of my roommates. He's gone. 

Joe can't but Nala was another when he's gone, Joe became the General Manager of the Baltimore Colts and hire Don Sulla and done Schulich first coaching, head coaching stand course to ensure is very famous. It catch today, but Joe passed away playing handball years ago. A heart attack condition with sure. 

So I've lost two of my roommates. I've got one still alive somewhere in the world and I think I'm still kicking around. Upon my Ohio State career was interesting. 

I was very active in student activities present in my class and all that kind of stuff, and had a good time and fraternity in whatever, had a good time there I enjoyed it was also Air Force ROTC. 

And even though when I started ROTC, the site of a rifle and trying to take it apart or to fire the thing scared me because I'd only fired little 2002 gotten before in summer camp. 

Which by the way is another interesting thing I should say, that you don't have many people in the category. 

What I'm going to tell you when I used to go camping, When my parents want to get rid of me in the summer, I went up to the North Woods and I can put Sioux Indians. And I'm a bloodbath, the Sioux. And I'm very proud of that. 

I still have a little scar under my, my left for us to show my blood Brotherhood to the Sioux Indians. I'm very proud of my sue relationship, American-Indian relationship. 

But any rate that I got interested in Air Force ROTC, even though, as I said. The appearance of the rifle and what I had to do with it scared me. It was bigger than weighed more than I did. And I always knew that when you work the shell changing part, you get best your fingers. 

So everything kind of worried me. I was awful and drill I didn't know a light left foot from a write that as bad as I wasn't dancing. 

But I got interested in it. And the Korean War broke out about that time, which even interested me more. I went into advanced ROTC Air Force on a basis that I was selected and applied. 

And this is why he was telling me I always Idaho State student and I became a member of the advanced Cadet Corps, Air Force ROTC, where I really got excited about a year for sin, graduated as a distinguished military statement from Ohio State. This was at 950 two, and became a member of a various academic honor areas and so forth. 

But that was very excited about Air Force or the Korean War was on. And I was called immediately to active duty. And I served two years in the US Air Force. 

Active duty during the Korean War in research and development, where I got the background that I use extensively since in academics, especially here at Tech. 

But I was involved with various types of Air Force tests, from nuclear thermonuclear weapons to aircraft, to various kinds of bomb systems. Basale test activity. 

My center of attention and of course, stories from those days could be told four hours of two years of active duty and during the Korean War Air Force. That set a pattern for me which I might add and delete it. 

I and upon discharge from the Air Force two years, I chose not that although I couldn't because I was a distinguished military student, I could have had a regular commission and made it a career, but I'm not the kind of person who likes to move around and that would say deterrent to me in that regard. 

But I love the Air Force and I got out. 

But immediately got active in the Reserves where for 29 more years I was active and I retired as an Air Force full colonel from the US Air Force Reserve. 

And 982 had a great opportunity to work in with the Air Force Reserve, various capacities ending before I got into a command position that a lot of work in developing anti terroristic plans, which in the seventies people thought would not occur. We didn't have to worry about it. 

But those of us who knew what was going to happen in this world knew we needed to plan accordingly. 

So I had a very, very fine career with the Air Force Reserve. And I thought we said this. 

And my students probably feel that way because iliac, right, I am first a military officer of the United States. 

That is my first and I will, I'm a professor and a lot of things, but I'm first a colonel in the United States Air Force and will never accept anything. He's being more important in my life than that. 

So patriotism, perhaps a little, maybe just that, but I'm very proud of that. And I will always consider myself first, Colonel Hitler before doctor or professor Adler. 

So that was my air force. A lot of stories that we can tell there. 

But I think the biggest thing is it gave me an excellent base of knowledge for research and development management, which has been one of the specialties of Georgia Tech it might and my dogs and my light things like Kobe. Okay. 

So upon leaving the Air Force active duty after the Korean War, not getting the kind of guidance that we give students today. 

I knew very little about graduate education, but I had a couple buddies and by the way, I get out as a first lieutenant. 

And something else might be interesting, I was in the team that developed what is now known today while on active duty, it's matrix management or project organization. 

So I'm one of the developers of that concept, a project organization which was developed for the intercontinental ballistic missile. 

Which was a major crisis because the Russians, the Soviet Union, had, we felt that from intelligence, that capability and they could've knocked us out. And they were saying at that time, we will destroy you. 

So President Eisenhower sent a directive to the Department of Defense and turn to the research and development command of which I was a member of the Air Force was still knew we were only a few years old, was coming out of the Army Air Corps that we get involved in developing a, an intercontinental ballistic missile to equalize the balance of power. And to do that, we develop project organization. 

And this gave me a lot of concepts, systems management, so forth that I've been able to use at Georgia Tech sense. 

Anyway, that's leading the Air Force active duty and 950 for I had heard some of my buddy lieutenants talking about graduate school, masters degree, what is this? 

I didn't know. That's how much guidance that we've been given. In my day in the bachelors programs of state. 

I knew more about student athletics and teams of Ohio State, my varsity letters and I knew about academics in that regard. 

But I said, Well, this is interesting. 

Master's degree, what is it? 

My one of my buddies was going for a master's degree back to Indiana in agriculture. 

And I'm thinking, well, gosh, can you go for anything else? 

That's how little I knew DOAC because I don't plan to be a farmer, so I don't know that I want to go to masters for agriculture. 

But I acquired further and I founded and realized that I had an uncle in Miami, Florida who was teaching part-time. There. 

His name is Akram and Ackermann insurance agency, which was a big win in Miami and he was teaching part-time the School of Business at Miami. 

So checking with him, That's the University of Miami. I found that that's something that at school I could go to Miami, Florida. Wow. And after the Korean War, that sounded really neat. And a, and I could get a scholarship and so forth, which I did and the student assistantship. 

So I went to Miami. 

But before doing so and I was thinking about this, I went to work for the Department of Defense as a civilian supervisor with my commander research and development command and the organizational statistics unit, I was a civilian supervisor. 

But in this Air Force Operation, Westinghouse Electric interested in May because of some of the background I had and they had on their electronics division at Friendship Airport, which still now I think it's called BY a submits at Baltimore Friendship Airport. 

And I hit a lot of experience at that airport as an eardrum officer while on active duty because being station in Baltimore, we use that for our Air Force aircraft and in those days, again, for flights a day, it was something today that's a very, very heavily traveled airport. 

But at any rate, the Westinghouse was located out there. There are electronics division heard about me somehow or other. I don't exactly recall. We got together and they gave me an offer. 

I went there and I worked in what would have been certainly for our students of today, amazing things. 

If we were working on computers, to develop computers, to operate the rear turrets, got insurance of Navy Aircraft, specially carrier aircraft. 

Well, for a memory of about five K, which today it would be such a small chip, you couldn't say it. 

The thing was bigger than anything I could carry, but we worked on that and I worked in industrial engineering department and learned a lot, a lot of things that I've been able to bring sense to my teaching career. 

And the opportunity in the University of Miami did come through and 950 five to go down there to teach and to get my MBA. 

So here I was down there and good old Miami and I was eating it up. I loved it and they told me, here is your class, I go teach it. 

Well, I'd had some experience lecturing academically before. 

I had lectured at the Naval Academy on research and development management while on Air Force active duty during the Korean War because of the experiences I had, they wanted to her that may chip in to hear this. 

That also given a couple of lectures at Johns Hopkins, some people I knew asked me to talk about it in the School of Engineering there. 

So it wasn't my first appearance before a class as an instructor, but it was my first in terms of where it was my class, my own. 

And they gave me the book and told me to teach it well, interestingly enough, at that time, the University of Miami faculty in the School of Business was not that well known who was developing a great reputation in marine biology, developing a law school at a very fine med school, which is quite famous for today. 

But I had some super faculty down there to help me. Miami faculty, University of Miami faculty in its own right. 

But a number of the Wharton professors in the University of Pennsylvania, he came down there in for one whole semester to get away from the weather in Philadelphia. I had some really outstanding Wharton professors there. 

And one that I remember listening to a number of our lecture is Lilly and guilt breath who wrote the book and whenever cheaper by the dozen. 

And as the developer of many concepts of time and motion studies, I had some excellent training there. 

The first-class I went into, I had Probably at that 30 or 40 students and I was literally is a great student and those conditions about one step ahead of the students in the book. 

But I had some experiences I could bring to them when I started, I got involved in teaching there. I had the same time. I was a graduate student getting an MBA. And I gotten ball involved with the kind of thing that interested me with the Orange Book Festival. 

And I was going to write my thesis on the yangmal festival, impact on Miami and the head of the orange ball at that time, I think his name was there any siloed and the entrepreneur orange ball guy today I think it's at Georgia Tech. I had said that but anyway or any Sattler and my uncle were friends. 

So that gave me the entree there. And I got involved in research. 

The Orange Bowl, finished my academic degree there and liked it so much that I stayed as an instructor. 

And that's their job, 950 nine as an instructor and had some very interesting people as students who have gone on to a great deal of prominence in life since then. 

But I think what I was thinking about this yesterday about it and something called it to my mind. One of my students there, D2L and they were sisters. We got to be very good friends. And when I became a student assistant, we were good friends. I wasn't that different in age from those stub them at that time. 

And so ultimately, I would be able to use their friendship if I had, I think that's a good way of saying I was being, I was able to take advantage of that friendship when I was working on my doctoral dissertation to limit their house in Cleveland, Ohio when I did go back to Ohio State for doctoral work. 

But one of the young ladies married normal trip, who is one of the three founders of Alamo car rental. 

So those are kind of people that a lot of people who were successful at the University of Miami, fan Kirsty who was my student. And gave me another special kind of categorization. 

I'm probably the only professor of Management in the world, let's say a to coat head football coach at the University of Kentucky. 

One was France, courtesy from who was my student there and later Bill Curry who was my student here at Tech. 

But we're getting a little ahead of ourselves. 

So anyway, I decided I would, under pressure from the dean go for PhD if I wanted to stay in academics, I had to. 

So where do I go? 

What I still don't know that much. I go back to where my roots are, go back to applied Ohio State. 

And I did get my acceptance for a fellowship teaching fellowship, research, and acceptance to the PhD program at Ohio State. Went back there and 950 9. That was the beginning of a new era. In the meantime, various things that occur that influenced some of my thing, Some of my life. You're at Georgia Tech. One of my students down at Miami was father was the big sports car entrepreneur. 

He he brought us the dealer for sports cars and you name it any kind of exotic sports car? 

Well, that got me interested in, especially living in Miami and all of the opportunities there to impress women, you needed to eat sport car. 

So I got involved with jaguars, which had some impact later at Georgia Tech bot. 

I wound up buying a jaguar from a prominent movie star because her husband ran around with a student of mine. 

So I had several of them down there. And while I was there, I did some radio work as well. And so I had to do a little bit of that. I'm like failure then go back and background. 

While I was at Walnut Hills High School, I was involved with w well, w radio station that you might think, what's the most powerful radio station in the world? 500 thousand watts. And it's now their towers and Cincinnati, or the Voice of America Tower as far as I still know. 

But they had to cut back, overwhelmed everything. 

But I worked with the Cluny sisters, rosemary and Betty, where there are many others. I did sound effects for inner sanctum. 

Some of the, I think even we did a shadow, the shadow show there with who I can think of, the famous actor who did that. The shadow, it'll probably come to me. 

But another interesting thing, I think Homer writes, our Athletic Director here at Georgia Tech. I think he was either in school with the Cluny sisters or they went to Highlands High. I think he went to for Thomas high, but that was right across the river from Cincinnati. Anyway, proceeding from there, leaving the radio thing again. And while I was at Ohio State as an undergrad, I also did great. I had a radio minor work that WAS OSU, the state of Ohio radio station. 

So a little more down in Miami, but now it's back to going to Ohio State as a PhD student. And it was an interesting time for Ohio State and athletics. 

There were some very prominent athletes there who at one time or another were either regular students of mine or I took classes like any PhD student of professors, of your professors when they're gone. Phd student activity then was quite a bit different. It is today, You literally pledged fraternity. You literally pledged. They told you to wash your car, their car, you would do it. 

So at different today, lived in fear every day of your, and these were all famous professors. 

The father of management than classical management theory or C Davis was my professor, Mike, do you see as the biggest name and personnel management professor TEN Beckman who develop that were wholesaling. It was his word and his doctoral dissertation. Those were professors at mine. 

So you knew that knowledge you could get, but you lived in all of them. And it was an interesting thing from the standpoint, if they asked you to take place, you would. 

So some of the students I had one way or another, they are a very famous Today. 

Bobby Knight, the Indiana basketball coach, I think he was in the school physical education, but he wound up somehow or other some of my classes, John have a check. One of the great NBA stars, Jackie Nick class. Isn't there. 

Jackson right now is one of his his youngest son as a student of ours at Georgia Tech right now, like Nick class. 

So there were some rather prominent people that they are in terms of the things that they have done since they have left at Ohio State. 

We had some interesting times there and working obviously as a PhD student under the conditions that we said, we learned a lot, we were under a lot of pressure and they did not at that time give you a year or two or three to do your research after you finished your coursework, you had to go out a job somewhere and get your research done on your own. They only gave you two years of the fellowship. 

So as a result, in my second year after completing all my qualifying exams, finishing those days, you had a foreign language requirements, all of that kind of stuff. I started looking for a position again while I had elite status with the University of Miami. And that interested me. 

But I start getting other opportunities and other offers and a number of them were coming into play. 

In the meantime, I remember driving the University of Miami between my home and Cincinnati and there over the summer I would see the tech tower. And Georgia Tech was always fitness name. 

Always famous, name it because it plays, it is even more famous today, but it has a certain mysticism to it. And that interested me. 

So are we, so I either wrote, are called down here and see if they had any opportunities, anything opening. 

Well, at that particular point, Walter Buckingham was a director of the School of Business, School of Management. Pardon me. We were a part of the general college at that time. This was in 1961. And we had a he had said that at that point that no, they didn't have any openings. 

But it interested me stale and I had opportunities from Rutgers, University of Oklahoma, Michigan State, Wayne State. 

There are a whole bunch of state was talking to me about staying there, but I felt I'd always be a paycheck PhD student if I stayed there. 

So I had an opportunity at the University of Wyoming. And I remember the day I was going out there. I said, Well, I'll go see it. That the night before I read the temperature was 23 degrees below 0 and layer on me. 

So I call that next morning and said that I didn't think it would work for me. 

So I decided I had opportunities on the West Coast, but I decided at University of Washington, that was one, but I decided, by the way, always know you're talking to a Cincinnati and we cannot say wash. We have to say wash. We cannot say sync. We have to say sync. 

So you'll know you're from talking to Cincinnati and we say that, but anyway, I called down here, is upset and wrote a letter. 

They had no openings, but and I had all these other offers that were pending or about to be made as offers. 

So I got a phone call from Dr. Walter Buckingham, who was the, really in my opinion, the first true scholar. They had the School of Management at Georgia Tech up to then add nothing to disclaim others before. 

But he was a, he was a world-class scholar and economics. And walter he was, he ran around with people like Ralph McGill, people like that. He was big time. 

And so he call him and he said, Well, we have a professor, we are retiring and I won't bring this in because others can talk about. 

But the man whose position I took Professor Brown is a story and himself. He's very famous. You may have heard of them. 

And I say no more, but it was his position, he was retiring and that suddenly retiring and I would get his position. 

So they asked me to come down. I did come down and I went back home. I liked what I saw. 

I stayed at the Biltmore Hotel and hearts Field airport he just opened, but we drove down my brother and I and II. I got about Cincinnati a couple days later and I got a call from Dr. Buckingham offering me a position and accepted on the phone. I hadn't hung up with Michigan State called me and offered me a position. And I like glancing and Michigan State and had some prominent people there too. And I told him that I have to think about it. 

Well, the meantime, I call my doctoral chair, Dr. Mike juices and say, dr. 

Juices, I just accept the Georgia Tech and Michigan State just called me a second later and that's very attracted to. 

But if I change my mind, he says Don't. He said Your word is gold and it's got to stay goal, you go where you accept. 

So on that basis, I became a Georgia Tech assistant professor in the day. 

This was I accepted this offer in 960 to probably winter, spring, and summer 960 to arrive at Georgia Tech. 

What were your first impressions? 

Well, my first impression was I have not cleaned the office out that I was given and that was one of the attractions that would have a private office, but they hadn't cleaned it out from Professor Brown. 

And there were various things in that office that when I saw it I said, Oh what? 

Today they give professors tours. They bring him in with their wives for days to look around and whatever. I couldn't even get anybody to to tell me where to stay. I hit this jaguar that I bought from this from this famous movie star. I won't use her name because she may not want it used and but well, her name was Saint John, Jill. Jill St. John. She was on Gilligan's Island and all that. And she went with she was dating this friend of my student. That's how I got to know I got a car. 

Anyway, I had this famous jaguar that I brought down here I am with this little Jaguar, read Jaguar, my stuff and everything I own. 

And that was, that was something in itself that it got here because jaguars to this day are famous for breaking down. 

And I was afraid it would be was always breaking down on me and I was afraid I'd never get here, but here I got everything going. I don't know anybody here to speak of. Buckingham, the director when I get here told me he was busy and hit time to see me. The office was a grand mass. Nobody I didn't know where to go, where to stay. All I'd ever done in Atlanta was pass through. 

So maybe stay at a hotel on the way to Miami. 

So anyway, I was a little bit disheartened by that. 

So I start driving around and just looking around, lives drive and out points. I hit my window down. 

And I got another great Welcome to Atlanta, is up driving by what was the old cracker baseball park across from Sears warehouse on pons. All of a sudden I've Sutton came through the wind. It was white. 

What it was was either a home run and ever gotten a feel to see or a foul ball out of the cracker stadium playing and my car. 

So that was the beginning of my Georgia Tech life. What Dr. 

Adler hear you I know you're in Atlanta and what happened? 

Well, as I was mentioning Maryland after the ball and in my car and I didn't know it was a ball at that time. I didn't know what it was. I do some white had gone by. 

I could see down at the corner of my eye and in my car, but it didn't make that much of a noise because I had so much clothes in the back in this little Jaguar, that's where it landed. 

And it was across from what is with Sears big warehouse store, an old cracker stadium, and that was about the end of the Atlantic crackers. Anyway. At that particular point in my life, I needed to find a place to stay. 

Well, I found that I came back to the campus or sometime when that first day I ran into another new hire associate professor by the name of Malcolm gatherer. 

And Malcolm and I immediately became friends and he gave me a few hints and so I wound up on in a motel on Northside Drive that night. It's now across from that strip club, whatever the name of it is. 

And there's a sign out front of a gypsy lady who will tell you, you're fortunate, if you know it's right up your Northside Drive. And I wound up in that hotel that night on Northside Drive because I didn't know anything. We know expressways here then Northside Drive was 41. That was the way you came in and out of Atlanta. I knew that street from going between Cincinnati in Miami. 

So I wound up at that motel and I decided I would take a week's rate because I didn't know or else I would go. 

And the the interesting thing is that the guy on the desk, I told him that I was going to be a professor at Georgia Tech. 

And I heard about Georgia Tech for 15 minutes and I immediately got the idea at Georgia Tech was everything to Atlanta, It was everything. There was no airport to speak up hearts be able to just open the new, which has now gone. They'd replace the old barn with this new beautiful airport, which is no longer in existence. And so that was Georgia Tech was everything to Atlanta at that period of time. And I'll tell you more about that as we proceed. 

But at any rate, he made me feel that I made a very good choice because here I was immediately in the city of where the school I was going to work at was sort of the center of attention. 

So with Malcolm's help and whatever, ultimately not a, no help from anybody down here, none. 

In fact, I think some of the faculty resented me being here because this was a major transition that was being made. And faculty up to then number of the faculty had no PhD degrees. The School of Management did not have that great at academic reputation. And I might have been an intruder to this system. That didn't mean we didn't have some great faculty. We had like Fred when who the student center is named after. 

But I remember talking to one professor very early in my days here because I had to teach a marketing course which I was equipped to do. 

And At that time, the concept of the rational consumer and rational bang by consumers was quite the question. 

So one day after a marketing class and went into him, I will mention his name because he didn't look good. And what I'm going to save it. It was typical of what we run into. And he was a very prominent senior professor here. 

And I went up to him, I said professor so, and so what do you think that the rational consumer concept in his answer to me was, do you think tackle when in football Saturday against Alabama. 

So I said, Oh, well, I may not be the most scholarly environment. 

And then to add insult to injury, the next day, I was coming into the class in the classroom building where the School of Management was at that time, the second floor, they just moved out of Swan Hall. Skiles was a new building. To know the bricks were falling down from it. It was still a new building. And the head of the English department, Jack Walker, if I recall, I think I was named Jack Walker. Dr. 

Walker saw me as I was coming in the building and he stopped me and said, You know, obviously I was new. He asked me who I was and I introduced myself. I told him I was a new professor in the School of Management Assistant professor. He said, Well, you've got a lot to live down and a lot to live up to it. 

So I said, Well, then I'd had this. There were just other things that told me we were in a major transition change. And, and Dr. Walter Buckingham was a scholar and he was going to make those changes. 

So there are some, several other people like myself were hired, but we were somewhat intruders because we were the new young breed, a professor to maybe more research oriented or whatever from, we were coming from Big Ten and Ivy League schools. 

And a lot of the faculty here had no PhDs, are they came from Southeastern schools like Louisiana State University. Not that they're weak schools or Arkansas or whatever. They're not weak schools, but they're great schools, great universities. 

But unfortunately, the way images are, you don't always have the NH of what you deserve. And it wasn't an image of the Big Ten or the Ivy League. 

So at any rate, it was a change and we're frankly, we're gonna kinda smell that might have been at Maryland or in some way make them look lesser because they'd been run in the show and a lot of them have no PhD or terminal degrees. 

So it was not an easy transition. I got no help. My office was a mess. It was 10 sex in the classroom building from the previous professor who had it. 

And if you've ever heard anything about that individual, you would know that I had a lot of work to do to clean up. I had no help. Nothing from physical plant, nobody. That's what we call it at that time, physical play. I had to do it myself. It took me years really to get I cannot tell you the things I had to clean out. 

But at any rate, you talk to some of the students back in the fifties who had this professor, they can tell you some stories that we tell you what I had to clean out. 

Did you feel that the administration was behind you? 

That we're not really not really, no, not really. I mean, they were somewhat helpful. 

And if you talk about administration at Harrison was the president, I'll never forgive him for the fact that every time he would see me was going to eat, asked me how I enjoyed my graduate education. She thought I was a graduate student. 

And, you know, it's kind of an interesting thing because I was certainly one of the youngest faculty on the campus. 

I was, I was about 30, 31, but I've still quite young because we had an older fact that a lot I'm retired military whatever as a new look totally. And he he was a Navy guy. I think he flew planes off carriers on weekends and at loved at Harrison loved the Navy. And everybody thought I was a grad student. He could never get away from that. Kind of interesting today. 

There I was young today on the oldest faculty member in the School of Management, one of the age of 66. 

Well, I'll be 66 and August one of the oldest faculty members at Tech, but Maryland at that particular time, knowing what what was going on in the School of Management, whatever. I still hadn't gotten my degree, I had to keep working on it. Remember, they didn't give us the opportunity to finish the dissertation at Ohio State. 

So my early years here, I was working to finish that degree. And my dissertation was on Railway Labor problems created by digitalization. 

Well, before I left Ohio State, I did take one year, essentially where I did nothing but research. 

And I loved either my parents home in Cincinnati or the home of these people in Cleveland, Ohio, who I told you, the one daughter married the one of the three founders of Alamo car rental their name with maintenance. 

I lived at their home because a lot of my doctoral research was based out of railroads in Cleveland, ohio. 

And While involved in that, I wrote diesel locomotives all over the Eastern part of the US studying what went on in the labor problems created by that. 

So anyway, I proceeded to do when your doctoral research before I came here, but then when I came here, of course, I had to teach, I had to finish set dissertation. 

Well, it was interesting. Some of the young faculty that came through that didn't stay. 

I remember one in particular, bill Muse, who I liked a lot at that time, was the advisor to take fraternity and he'd been a boutique fraternity field advisor. 

How did their national office and somehow or other things didn't work out for him, but I liked him a lot. He left well today he's the president of Auburn University. There is a great guy and I always would have enjoyed having them as a colleague here. 

But I, you know, we had some interesting people coming and going here. And in the meantime, I'm teaching. My red Jaguar is getting a lot of prominence. 

And at that time I had some alarms who, well, for students who became famous alum's, Bill Curry for example, one billy lot rate you just, it was a very famous Georgia Tech football player who just died this past week is better effect. 

And there number of very prominent who are today very prominent alarms whereby students at that time, what was your impression of the steeples can't attack. They were bright. They in the School of Management, we could not have women at that time. Women could not come to Georgia Tech School of Management. They could go to Georgia, Georgia State School of Business, but couldn't be here. 

Hillary, they were in the skull because again, when they were Georgia Tech, yeah, but they couldn't be in the school advantage mechanism. 

So what this meant is that the land and the School of Management in general. 

In fact, the men on the Canvas Specialist School of Management, dressed one level above indecent exposure. Some of them, some of the football players you wouldn't believe. 

And things when women did come that improve the dress, the appearance, but there were bright green declaring who when they came in, about 960 eight and I'll say, Yeah, I'll show you how that came about. 

But the students were bright student athletes. 

There were a number of them were very food, became very famous out of that group in various capacities. 

But they were bright. Of course, getting students to study is always challenged beyond reason in many cases. 

So nothing changes there, but they were bright, but we had no women in the School of Management. 

We had no minorities at that time, but then eat any that I can that I know that we didn't about well things and let me just throw this in, vary with another prime and I like sports cars. 

So I got rid of my red jaguar and I gotta believe it or not, a Plymouth valued station wagon, the other extreme, but that didn't last long. I want to go back to do sports cars. 

So I spent a lot of time at lunch when I had my lunch time going up here to peach tree dealership called Southeast and southeastern I think the southeastern downing sports cars. 

Well, one way or another they are I would be constantly trading for cars and I got myself an Alfa Romeo find lay sports car. It would not start if the weather got below 45 degrees. 

So nobody ever knew if it got below 45, what I never get here or not. 

Well, I didn't last long, got rid of that car, but some prominence came out of that. 

I got myself a buddy who over and continue education, who was assistant director over there, who was interested in sports cars to and I would take him up there with me to see what was going on. 

Well, ultimately, he got interested in Ferrari's and today, through going up there with me and today he is the Ferrari distributor for the entire Southeast United States. I think it's called FAA yet motors and Tucker, you encountered was his name. 

But we were we were very, very comfortable with our cars at those days. In the meantime, I'm working on my dissertation. I'm still single. 

Nobody ever stays in Miami at the University of Miami and it gets married very quickly if they're out of their minds. 

So it was too much fun. Signal. 

So, and I didn't get sing that didn't get married obviously as a doctoral student. 

So anyway, things got to the point here where I was finishing up my dissertation and I needed a typist to do it. 

Well, I got a secretary here and when she spelled coal for speaking the coal tender of a steam locomotives with with C Okay. E and whatever our CEO AT, I knew that wasn't going to work. I tried to find other people to do my typing and I could come up with anybody. 

And a professor at just come here by the name of Norman and who had been the chief speech writer and an executive assistant to Watson, the CEO of IBM. Norman had some research work. He would get tight and stuff he'd send back to IBM plus academic work he was doing. And I ask him who has type this was. 

And he told me about a young lady over in School of Chemical Engineering and metallurgy who was his type US but he said that I told him my niece and you won't get a chance with Isaac, she is not going to be the best on campus. Each line that people line up to get stuff type there. 

So her name was Don Lynn Gibson and she was in a school metallurgy. 

Bob Hoffman was the director of the Department of Ed or G in the school chem engineering about Hoffman was a director. 

So Marilyn, I said, Well, what can I lose? 

I'm desperate. My, my doctoral Chair, Mike juices, was going to leave Ohio State, go over the University of Arizona. I had to get this thing tight and done and approved, arrive at a production. I may never have gotten it. And it was red. It was done was at that point in time. 

So I said, Well, I'll go over and talk to it. 

Well, I called her on the phone first and she said the cheapest booked up for months. I said I'll go save. 

So I go Seder. 

And it was the same thing I said, there isn't there are various ways that you can take care of such challenges to this. 

So I then called her and asked her if she'd go out on a date with me. 

Well, this was in about the end of January. This was at the end of January. And I can just tell you this. 

We got married on April the first told my and darker and darker April 1st and we will be married 30 years in 28 dip at 26 days will be our 30th wedding anniversary with recently sense. And it takes a day. Not only did she typed my dissertation, but nobody else's work ever got touched again. One of my colleagues went after I was done, got here is Fred sharply over in economics. She typed is formed. 

But that was Curt. 

But there's something very interesting that came out of this as well. That when Don and I got married, we had a nepotism rule in the university system then. And they said, one up, you have to quit. 

Well, at that particular time in Chem Engineering, chem engineering rain, Georgia Tech then the day Jesse Mason, the Dean of Engineering, you've heard of the Mason building here. 

Jesse was the Dean of Engineering and Paul Weber who was chem engineering, he was vice but he was what is the provost? 

And Kim engineering was very potent. 

Baltimore Ziglar was over there and some of the people that started Scientific Atlanta and LA engineering, they were all over there at that time. And Donna was very important to all of them. And they were furious. 

They were infuriated that she would have to lead, but obviously she would leave, not me because you would go where you had the greater salary and obviously I had not done it. Was that great? 

But it was great or let's put it like that. 

So everything is relative. 

So as a result of all that, she diddly, but as a result of all the fewer the nepotism rule was changed. And now we have cases of husband and wife in the same department here. She was a secretary. 

I was a professor, totally different schools at Georgia Tech, but that broke and wife alcohol drank, that broke the nepotism. Bury your university system. Sacrifice. She was the sacrifice, but she went to work for Texas Instruments and enjoyed that. Money back from probably get Broglie did. I don't recall. It was too busy spending to remember. 

But at this point now I had my degree, I hit the PhD degree. And Dr. 

Sherman Dallas was the Director of the School of Management and we were now moving to become a college and move out of that. 

What was the general college at that time? 

So a guy named professor named Hefner was a dean at general college, but we were making the move to get out. 

It was about this time that, Hey, what, Solomon came to Georgia Tech, the first black student in the School of Management. And we were still a school of management than not a college. And Haywood, the first African-American student in management. 

And somehow or other I met, hey, would I liked him and I felt that they didn't know it would be good for him to have. I'm Professor looking at form because I knew this place was cold. 

I was still suffering from the coal, believe me, I was not it was not a warm place as far as I was concerned. Faculty involvement, maybe with students. There might have been more. I didn't even see that. Frankly, I didn't see the student report that I would have liked it. 

Certainly I didn't have the report with other faculty that the, the older faculty seem to resent the younger faculty like myself, we were a new luck. We might if we were a threat to them in some way, I'm sure the adjustment was not an easy one. 

So at this particular point, Haywood came in and I to school in one way or another, decaying mice and very fine student of mine. And then I convinced him that graduate school, whatever. And he went to work for Procter and Gamble and you know what, a great success, uh, yesterday. 

Well, by the same time we were moving to become a college out of the general college, become our own under the leadership of Dr. Sherman Dallas, it was a dean. 

And where were some other interesting things are going on in through Buckingham, who has since left to go to Drexel Institute as Director of their School of Economics. 

I met some of the prominent newspaper people downtown and Ralph the gill, if I recall, was still there. 

These people I'm not absolutely convinced were who thought that? 

At that a little grocery store that was up near where I lived on Peachtree done what he had found by the way, a place to live. It was a little guest house of larger home on Peachtree done Woody. And that's where I live till I got married. 

And this was very close to the area of the intersection of paper sham and Roswell wrote an IV, if you know that area and there was a little convenience store there that was open late hours. And I had a dog, but then I always had a dog. 

So late evening, I would go there to get dog food while there was a consortium of us, some very prominent people who live near there who would always be there. I got to know and Ralph McGill, it was one he deleted. 

I'm quite sure that it's gotta be sure that he wasn't dead by then, but I'm sure that was Ralph McGill. 

He had a home on Piedmont so that we're all those Piedmont Center buildings are and that's where financial center he had a home there. 

And as I recall, Joanne Woodward, the actress, her dad was there, I think at that time and this is what I'm not sure. 

It was my understanding he was writing the pet dog column for the journal constitution and he was there. 

And the guy that right, that wrote Mark Trail, he would be there at died he just legally lived up to say These brings up Brandon middle road at his estate, the loss for us. 

And there was some other prominent people, evidently, I don't think a bridge club or whatever, but they would be there and eat. 

Well, one way or another. I got to know these newspaper people, Jack's balding. He was editor of the journal. What we're Buckingham do these people and I wound up writing about once a month. 

The second page called the readers form of the Atlanta Journal Constitution on Saturday. 

And I wrote it for some time, usually on transportation problems, things like back and 62, I propose we put signs on the expressways so people would know the extent of traffic ahead, whether they should get off that we could electronically flash. 

We didn't have the computer activity then but capability, but things that they're talking about doing now we were proposing and some of these columns back then. 

So at any rate, I got involved in the newspaper business. 

I was doing radio work at this time Because as well Georgia Tech own radio station WGS, 80 people do not realize that stands for Georgia School of Technology given by the how family to tech. Anyone. 

The announcers of GST were in the staff of Joe on the staff Georgia Tech, they were carried in the Georgia Tech. We call it a phone book as staff members. 

And I was working with Bob Wallace, who was director of public relations here, Public Affairs who wrote the book dresser and white and gold. And so. I wound up doing a lot of Georgia Tech broadcasts, particularly on Sunday night, WGS t. 

So it was back and radio. 

And we, you know, we had a good time doing that and that was something that I was doing at that period of time. And because Georgia Tech GST was a Georgia Tech operation as you know, Dr. 

Pedot later sold it was headquartered we're rec is now over there by the human resources office and calcium. 

So anyway, at this particular point in time, if we go back to what was going on at Georgia Tech, pushing to become a college. We did under the leadership of Dr. Dallas, right here where this was, I think about 68, we became a college. 

And about the same time there were several of us pushing to get women into the college and we succeeded, and women were allowed to enter the school. 

Now, I think the college about judgment, about 168, That's a rough approximation, maryland of when women were able to come into the system at the time, the integration process with everything. Haywood though was here and an African-American students before that, women came later. And the women, I couldn't remember some of the first women students. The impact was really good because it's sharpen them then. They now had to look good in class in a parents and their academic capabilities and performance. 

So it was good, it was really good for tech and every which way and you were comfortable with it? 

Oh, absolutely could. Because you see from my standpoint, I taught women. Hello, I'm University of Miami at Ohio State. I was very comfortable with teaching them or being a student with them. 

So at this point though, we got, some of my students came into play in between, let's say, the middle sixties and seventies came into my classes. Some people who would be exceptionally prominent in the region and the nation, even worldwide. 

Some of the people then there were students of mine that are critically important today, John outer hold, I think everybody knows John was my grad student. 

I had about eight or nine of my students who became generals in the US Army because West Point send its finest graduates with some experience in the military to us, to Vanderbilt and I think to ln and Special Operations Research, management science type programs for a masters. 

So I got some, let's say we call them water walkers. And in fact went up and came back here. Wayne Davis to be commander of the Arab army ROTC, and later Brigadier General. 

But Qin king, of course, a major developer in Atlanta. Jim Hawkins, who is one of the major executives of the Federal Reserve sixth district. 

And again, and I'll tell you about one of the most interesting classes probably ever taught here at Tech. 

Jack Winn, who is now just need the president of the Sixth District Federal Reserve, the first Georgia Tech person ever to be named President of Federal Reserve Bank. 

We are the largest district by the way of any, yeah, they'll either 11 Federal Reserve districts and he's Jack was one of my grad students at that time. 

You were hearing from high caliber people? 

Definitely Joe Rogers who does tie I think at that time he and his day at operated to small restaurants is built Waffle House. 

The CEO, Mike McCarthy, who was his number two man, his deputy Chief Financial Officer at Waffle House. There. 

So many of them, Richard Robinson, who is a premier professor now at the University of South Carolina. It could go on and on and on. Charlie spit goal the third. 

These were my students at the time and they're just just one after another, many of whom now I had been able to bring back to our various deans boards and alumni boards for our management school. 

But these are some of the people that literally are the biggest names in Atlanta. At this time, Dr. 

Adler, you were here during enough staffing here at Georgia Tech at the time the Kennedy assassination. Gerry, remember what it was like? 

I can't remember very well. I can remember that it was I think it was like silence everywhere. It was like there was an eerie silence after that. It really, it really hit. It really hit because the school is, we're famous for not reacting. I mean, this is a man of rebellious, revolutionary campus. Everyone's focused on studying on what careers are. 

But you did sit here and say a lot of history happening? 

Yes, it saw the impact and it was an eerie silence. 

And I would tell you some, you know, we can talk about presidential politics because I worked at the White House during the Carter administration and I've some things that might even a reflected back on this, but I would say that there was an eerie silence that, but did it totally upset the campus? 

Not really. Not really, but there was, you know, you felt that you could feel the tension in terms of silence. I guess that's all I can say, an eerie silence, but it didn't last long. Georgia Tech is a unique institution in so many ways. It is like an oasis and still is in the city of Atlanta. And we talked about it being it it was literally the only game in town. On Saturday. 

If you were prominent in Atlanta, you came to Georgia Tech football games. You came dressed like you were going to the most formal function go on. I mean, the women wore hats, they were dress. 

The most formal fashion that men wore suits, the students, I don't remember what they were particularly, but no one man, they were always want to step but unless the women were around, they were one step above indecent exposure. 

But Georgia Tech was the place to be and it was the center of that lab. We had no proteins here at that time. There was no, there were no falcons, there were no hawks. There were no hockey teams, there were certainly no Braves. 

And though all of these things were about to come, but at this time, Tech was the only game in town and Bobby Dodd was an icon of beyond, beyond any kind of question. 

And I later, I got to know him much later, much better because his granddaughter Kelly Thompson became my student and student assistant. 

And so I got to know the family quite well, but I started recruiting football players academically for Bobby Dodd, my first quarter here at 960 too, because I let them know that I was involved in this kind of thing and athletics, I had been a varsity letter man and could help. 

So we were, we were entering a whole new era of Georgia Tech and the School of Management because we were in our college and you could feel park and I saw it happening. 

Well, we're moving into the seventies, okay, and as I said, there are so many prominent alumni that I do want to mention and I know I'm leaving out some. One of my former students was just made the CEO of Apple, Gil Emilio. 

And there I just, as I say, there's so many prominent students that I've had people who become very, very active in the community and the nation. 

And I just, I know that Georgia Tech produced so many liters and I can talk about that and I will because I do that when I'm doing commute, recruiting and I heavily for the Athletic Association or for students in general. And I will talk about that. Why we can produce these kind of people. And we know we can't because we have with you. 

And they are there, just so many of them out of the School of Management, out of this school who have provided so much leadership in the community. 

And so, like I said, I hesitate to start mentioning names because I will leave out so many, so many of them though. 

I mean, there's so many major firms that are headed by government agencies and whatever, by former students, students of mine. And they come back, they come back and visit, talked my classes. 

But anyway it came the Vietnamese war. They were, there was some impact. I was a particularly noticing it because of the fact that I was very active in the reserves. 

I hesitated then some, some others hesitated to wear uniforms around which maybe we had to do if we had a reserve activity. I made sure I didn't wear it on the campus or West. Some resentment. 

But not like you would find at many other schools because this was Georgia Tech. 

There was Also at this time a countrywide and occurred here that became a whole new pressure on the Greek system. Fraternities and sororities. 

That was the beginning of the pressure that is really built up today on fraternities, sororities, and all seem to grow out of the Vietnamese war. 

Were there the protester types on this campus, not like you would find on other campuses because it's a more conservative, pragmatic student. They were not interested in those things as they were getting a career going and making money. 

So and that was good for us because it kept our campus generally restful and peaceful compared to other campuses during this Vietnamese era or Vietnam, Vietnam War era. The world was very shaky at this time. 

And we can say now we had moved from Harrison into the administration of have Hanson president aren't Hansen was president. He laughed about 970, 70 wanted to become president of Texas A&M or Purdue. I think he went to Purdue and then to Texas A&M. 

But I knew art because when he was dean of engineering here, which it came as far as he was a neighbor of mine. 

But we were moving into a whole new era in the seventies and the growth of the school land that the direction of Georgia Tech Joe PEDOT came as president. He was the former Dean of Engineering at Stanford and he had a heavy research orientation. And when Joe came here, the school with changed heavily toward a research direction, a whole new era. And at that old faculty who wanted to go that route, we're uncomfortable before you can imagine now. 

And Tom steles and he brought, Tom is director or vice president research in the school really made major inroads and research. It was the beginning of a whole new Georgia Tech, about 970. And the Vietnam War, the Vietnam war was coming to some sort of ending, but not, not yet. It was still going on. And what we were basically a peaceful campus. 

We're in fact, we were doing a lot of Defense research and getting it not having problems other campuses would because Snelson was bringing in a lot of money in that regard. The School of Management now College of Management was doing very well. It was bringing in more and more research oriented faculty. 

We had some interesting things going on right about this time that I think would be unique because I don't know if anybody else who's done it attacked. Maybe there was one other faculty member. About 1969 or seven, 970. We got the word at Georgia Tech. 

The administration did, I guess the President from the Department of Defense and Department of Air Force, that unless we provided graduate education for Warner Robins Air Base personnel, they might close that base. 

Well, they want to graduate education in particular and management. 

So as a result of that, the College of Management got a charge to develop graduate programs. 

Well, the way these we're going to be conducted, IT management was by telephone and electronic blackboards because we couldn't go down there that off and to do it. 

So I got the charge for this and I wound up by teaching three or four. I think it was four classes. 

All graduate level, but you could allow what I was undergrad and number but the others were all graduate number and I was teaching by telephone and buy an electronic blackboard. 

Now, to whom I was teaching is very interesting. 

This was the heart of the Cold War era to the Russians were, the Soviet Union was still saying they'd like to kick us off the earth. And so this was a constant alert period. 

And one of the groups that we were teaching at at Warner Robins that I guess I should say I was teaching what the alert pilots in the ready room or the B52 strategic nuclear carrying aircraft, that we're one of our major lines of deterrence that yet that point out of that and that was station, that group of stations were to Robins. 

So I hit guys in flight suits in ready rooms who could an instant be in their aircraft leading for the Soviet Union with nuclear warheads. Nuclear warheads. I had another group that I taught in the evening at another time. Who were it make a junior college based. 

But they were Warner Robins people, but they allowed some Macon people in there too. In a way that was done. I had a class in front of me because we didn't have a lot extra resources of about 30 grad students. And I had a 30 down there, roughly 30. 

And I went down there and got to know them and they were they were seated and I had a monitor down there. The way I teach is relatively well known as Socratic. I'm calling on them all the time. And so I was calling on my students up here and calling on them down there. I got to learn their voices. 

I knew where they sat and I hit a monitor down there to make sure they didn't try to trick me and taught when when I'm talking and then the other one didn't know the answer. 

So i an electronic blackboard where I wrote, literally wrote on a device here in Atlanta and a transmitted on a screen down there. 

So they talk about all this high tech teaching today. Only thing I didn't have was video. 

But being an X radio and answer, I knew how to talk to people, I couldn't say. So. I ran for classes like that. The program ultimately died because nobody else would teach it. 

I think that's why it ultimately died and we didn't get the pressure anymore from the Department of Defense on it, but it was an interesting thing. 

And Jack, when, who is now the new, newly named President of the Federal Reserve Bank of Atlanta, the largest district of the Fed replace forestall as president down there. Jack was in one of the classes in front of me. 

Now this was a very difficult period. 

And I remember that the Pueblo crisis, that was a ship crisis and the Vietnam area of the Berlin airlift, Berlin blockade. All of these were going on and I was an active reserves. I didn't know from day to day whether I would ever be back to teach a class for a while. 

So it was a hectic period of time, but it was a growth period for the College of Management in getting a much more research oriented faculty and for Georgia Tech and general in that regard, we were becoming a leading research institute. 

So that's where it all began orientation. 

This was the beginning the 70s when PEDOT came at the whole research thing and the at the collegiate units, we're going that way as well. If there's not a timely thing, developing are interested in the space program. You're talking about the US. Now. I think that they'd been going for some time and I just think that we continue to be involved there. 

That's an interesting thing in itself because our school of aerospace engineering has produced some of the most important leaders in aviation. 

Malcolm stopper or the retired vice chair or retired chair of Boeing, basically responsible for the development of 747. Richer truly, as you know, from nasa, John Yang, the head of nasa astronaut program. And I think we just had one or two of our students just in this space launch last week. Aerospace, which is producing African article a or in B. And now Louis Jordan, my buddy who is the present value dZ at his daughter was my student assistant. One of the McDonald's, I believe from McDonald Douglas. From here, we can think of thigh everywhere. 

And you know, when you talk about tech alum's, we might just look beyond General Dynamics, retired president, trying to think of his name. I normally lives, they just retire down there in South Georgia. Dow exon, and then the Vice Chair of the Board of DuPont, doc Blanchard, he just retired. I mean, you talk about big firms. Are people are up there. Pacific tell us this dorm and Eric touched, just spun off from them. Gil, Emilio was the CEO of National Semiconductor and Julie just went over to Apple. And you, wherever you go, there is a Georgia Tech person at the top. And I think that people say, well, it's because of the pressure we create here. Yeah, we do. And I've known as one of the most pressurized probably professors at Georgia Tech. 

But I say if that's all you came to Georgia Tech for to learn how to handle pressure four years of your life. 

I said I'll put you out the middle and expressway and 30 seconds you'll learn it and you got, if you live through it, you've got four years to do other things. 

But I think it's the, the knowledge we give them and the capability to learn to work hard and use knowledge and use your personality to get to the top. I think that's what we develop in all of our schools, certainly in management. Because I equate management and leadership to be problem solvers. Yes. 

Erratic and tell me if the challenges and but above all, to get knowledge and to use it and not let anyone else get ahead to tell you what to do, but you get to get ahead to tell the others what to do. And we've been very successful. We have built so many things. 

I often say that these buildings that we see downtown, either my students built them or they're running them, or they did both. Like I'd see that tower down there of Nations Bank. 

Well, Jim lens, the present innovations back to Georgia. He was my student and as I say, we can go on and on with the success of the text student. 

It is a unique accomplishment in terms of everything that we're about but with in Maryland, what is interesting, not only have we achieved academically in terms of our students, but in athletics, professional athletics, I think only North Carolina has more of its former basketball players in the NBA than we do. And just about all of them I've taught are recruited. 

Mark Price, famous guarding, set my classes when he was in high school, when we're grading, I'm John Sally. 

All of these these people, I was involved, I've been involved in recruiting student athletes for Georgia Tech since 1962. 

We are people achieve everywhere, everywhere and gosh knows how many in the NBA, NFL I've had and in baseball and whatever. And it's because I think we instill also a pride in being successful. 

It is the nature of the institution there is, I've been around universities now since 1955 with my own classes and 950 21, where I lectured at the Naval Academy or in Hopkins. I've never seen a school like this. It is unique, gets gotta mysticism about it. 

And of course we got the neatest mascot go on our good old, but there's nobody has got anything like buzz. 

But I can remember though the changes in athletics. It used to be the place to be on Saturday. Then we've friend into the competition. 

Well, the proteins, and it just goes all the way back to the early, early days and trying to talking to teens with Johnny Hypo, they do that and of course, parallax and Heisman, the Heisman trophy. People don't realize that Alexander and then died. 

But what was interesting before we didn't, when I came here, there were, I think there were about two women students. And the women you saw on this campus were secretaries. And there were about two of them here. 

And our marching band, we, if we had a dozen people in it with satin or major rats came from Agnes Scott. Or we had a professional major at in fact, for one. And cheerleaders, they were all male. And you can see the changes in women's team as well. There were no women's teams. And so you can see the changes there. 

But I think that what has occurred and I am a trustee of the Athletic Association, so I have to be the chair of the ticket committee appended at the chair at the wrong time. Evidently, when we redid the stadium a few years ago and seats were eliminated. I was chair when we redid the Coliseum, I was the chair. 

So I get a lot of heat here. I'm always Maryland on people not happy with their tickets. 

But what I have seen in athletics is very interesting because I believe I tell students when I'm recruiting them academically for check whether their student athletes are regular said students. 

That there are three things that hold the school, the school distinct and unique and give it this mysticism. 

And one is the academic achievement of our students, which is shown by the accomplishments of our lungs. All right. 

The second is the research that has come out of here and WD 40, that little spray can't, that's Georgia Tech people, Elmer's white glittering Clorox. 

I talk to you about downing Motor Company before I did show you the unique things that Mazda Miata is from a design industrial design student, by the way. 

Downing, some, Jim Downing who was my student, is now the head of the worldwide racing team of Bosnia. We do when we're everywhere, we weren't people do everything. 

Whenever I feel that if they do well, I've got at least a dozen of my students or clergy and axle and clergy. 

Excellent clergy I've got, oh, I can't tell you how many of my students are physicians now, that's another thing that I haven't mentioned to you. 

I became the consultant for the Center for Disease Control because safety management, being an R and D management guy coming from my learning of the military, my knowledge there I became CDC's management and safety management consultant in about 19 the middle sixties. 

And involved heavily with helping them develop techniques to handle somebody's very violet viruses that they're working with now is their safety consultant. It's always been an especial area mind learn a lot of this in the military. 

And as a result of that contact, I became the first person ever cross appointed between Emory Medical School and Georgia Tech, probably the first joint professorship between Emory University in Georgia Tech ever. Certainly the medical school. 

And that was one of the reasons why I never left tech to initially because I kept getting these good offers. Alumni chair at the school or of DNA, some sort at this other school. 

And I wanted to things not only did I had a love for this goal, it you cannot explain because of the mysticism and uniqueness of debt. 

But I didn't want to leave. This was a neat thing to be here. Great. 

Well, just to have the prestige and I'm professor in every med school and I wasn't there to develop management step my specialty and systems analysis. I was involved in medical systems diagnostic and prognostic protocols. I was involved in helping set up the diabetic daycare center, Grady Hospital. 

I've worked on Developing means of containing contamination of burn patients and therapeutic goals, developing and testing drugs for Parkinson's, various neuromuscular diseases, developing techniques to diagnose stroke in an emergency room, whether it was that or some other trauma. 

So number of publications, research there, worked with one of the world's great anatomist over there. And not too active anymore over there for one reason. Like, I guess people say they have more sense than me. They retired. 

My colleagues over there retired, went and I worked with anesthesiologists neurosurgeon to enter cats you're finding you're just getting in fact, I don't know. 

Well, people keep saying Adler, when you get out. 

I'd like to say, Yeah, I'm one of the oldest around, but the med school was a thing and I think very sad, It's very satisfying. 

And I would say that I think I was the first-person cross appointed between check and Emory and it was handled by the precedence of the two schools. 

And certainly I think the first between every medical school and Georgia Tech, so connection and that and I was the one who got a lot of the bioengineering the tech is involved with now going the market architecture stuff for physically handicapped statements, physically challenged students. I was I got a lot of that stuff go on in that connection. 

But to get back to attack, we were talking about athletics. 

We had a period where we're not that prominent for awhile and in, But other things came in to give us prominence. Jimmy Carter gave us a lot of prominence. During your counterpart during that time? 

Oh, yes. And while he kind of experience well, this was quite an experience while he was governor Maryland. 

I and a few other professors from universities, from schools at the University System of Georgia were asked to help state government in management development. 

And accordingly, I got assigned to management development for several government, a state government agencies. 

One was the Office of the Governor or the other with the Office of Public Safety, which is now but essentially the State Patrol, highway patrol, the Office of Education, the Office of Health, which is now part of that human resource department. As a result of that work, I got to know Jodi Pao quite well. I work with Jodie a great deal. 

And when Jimmy Carter was elected president, I became the organization advisor to the White House Press Office, which is the largest office in the White House still is. And they had a lot of issues. 

A job management, they've got a coordinate so many things with so many press secretaries, the government, defense, another federal government agencies and coordinating within the White House and also got involved with the Office of Management Budget as a consultant. 

Well, my four years working in the White House as a consultant, I commuted, I still get my job here was very fascinating because I was there for so many major things. The hostage crisis and ran, it was they are seeing many of these things happening. 

I remember when I first went there, there was a young reporter who always hang around the press office teletype machine and I always had difficulty getting buy into the office by the way, the press office, press secretary's office at about 10 feet from the Oval Office. 

But I'd always have trouble getting through that door because the teletype machine was near the door. There's always a guy leaning over, didn't want to miss anything. 

Well, that was Sam Donaldson and I wish I could remember. I asked Sam to move so I can get in the office. 

Well, I don't know. He's become rather prominent. 

But that was quite an experience. 

I had people walking by me, yes, Sadat from Germany or from Egypt, pardon me? 

And Willy Brandt from Germany and the Prime Minister of Israel, trying to think, write down the name slips made, but he and Sadat came up with that treaty. 

Who was it? 

Can you think of Maryland? 

Just name slips by, but for the moment, but I mean world-famous figures. And I went and I hung around there, the cabinet people, I got to know all of them just being there. And one day I was in the White House press office talking with what we're full. Who's Deputy Press Secretary for right now it's a major executive at newspapers. 

Talking with him, something we were doing and I'd say I worked on organizational structural matters for them, being it was the largest of the white house. Somebody hits me on the shoulder, grabbed my shoulder and says, always gotta be super ordinary. 

Well, this is a concept I've taught. 

Did you, managers leaders should never act superior to their subordinates, but they should always be super ordinary. 

So the subordinates get a positive respect that these are the people that can lead them to the success they went. 

Well, it was Hercy Harris. It was Hercy and you know who anarchy is it an outstanding student of mine. 

Another one of my outstanding students names and Hercy was the about the number two guy in office management budget. He took all financial bills from the Oval Office over to Congress. 

So it was Hercy. 

And as a result and Hercy and I we started talking more and I worked with him in his office and organizational matters. It matters organization management office called the Office of Management and Budget. Worked with YOU card or a lot you ran the White House and course. 

You and I are still close you today is co-chair of the deans Board of Directors for the School of Management. We're back to school under the present reorganization. 

So it was interesting, I always felt like was a tech whether I was there or here, because there was tech stuff all over everywhere in the White House. And of course, with you there, who was a tech grad. And by the way, you and our current president, Dr. cloth, were college fraternity brothers. They were Fiji together if I Gamma Deltas. And so I just felt like I was very much a tech, whether I was up there or whether I was town here. 

So that was my White House era period and the main time also, I was working with the city of Atlanta. 

I was in one of their major advisors on selection of executives and Martha, executive selection boards. I was doing my thing here. I was advisor to the Director of Personnel for the city of Atlanta. Did a lot of things. Always wanted to be involved in helping community which I lived. 

If you have a child panning. 

It first, deep concern is all the faculty, even those of us that were supposed to be research because his inaugural address, so to sounded like everybody's old gone. 

And although I was still relatively young, I was old and having been you're about 78 years, you know, it wasn't brand new, but there was a lot of concern about what would be his change in direction. 

However, I worked well with him and as a matter of fact, I did a lot of things personally for him that he asked me to do. I was chair with glide Robbins, essentially, the redoing of the whole parking system attack. We were the ones Yeah. 

Another hot neck are the ones who put the gates and up to then there was no paid parking and you can park anywhere except you couldn't find a parking spot. Faculty or students. 

So I was involved in redoing with Clive Robins if you've ever heard that name, tactile whole parking arrangement at Georgia Tech for president? 

He was certainly distinguished as a scholar. He he had certainly Presidential layer about, uh, no question about that. And he had a great interest in leadership. He was relatively reserved. He wouldn't be an individual that would show a lot of emotion. He was not an individual that you would get close to in any which way. 

But he was an individual that you got things done for him the right way or you've heard about it. And in fact, in his latter years, he named me to be the chair of the impartial Board of Review. 

Now, that's why I was asking about earlier about budgeting possessions because deeply involved in this issue of who's caught casts of classified staff, who is classified as faculty working on that right now. 

In fact, because IT or the impartial board of review for Georgia Tech that handles all grievances for staff personnel of Georgia Tech. And I was the first when we start that up still doing that. I'm still that chair to your favorite pet. It was good photonics. In his time? 

Yes. In his time. 

In his time he was because we needed to catch up and become more research oriented, or we were going to get lost in the shuffle of outstanding institutions of higher learning. You've got MIT and Cal Tech, and you've got those kind of schools moving ahead and research. 

We weren't moving, I think as well as we could see, it was good for tech at that at that time right now, whether he would have been good and an arrow like today, I do not know, but at the time, he was the right man. He was tough to work for you better, do a good job and you better, please what he was looking for. 

And I found that in chairing this impartial board review where you can imagine handling grievances very difficult. 

The reason I was asked to do that was because of my background and personnel labor or whatever, which I still teach a course in it. 

Even though my specialties management theory and management of research and development and high-tech operations. 

So he was not an individual, he was not a warm individual at all, but he was an individual that you knew who the boss was, you knew who the leader of Georgia Tech was? 

Eddie was he directed the research avenue that got us to, I believe, the kind of position where we became certainly a world leader in academic stature. He also was attuned to the fact that he had to get along with them. The power structure of Atlanta with Mr. 

Porter, if he's well-known for having had a good relationship, he knew how to work with the structure, something we hadn't really just that amount of time. He knew how to work with that structure anyway up with a fever? 

Yes, he do. Politically he was Tim and maybe it a criticism. It's more to their than he was to matters right here. 

But I'd like Joe PEDOT. I never call them Joe. I think that a lot of people dead but I didn't. 

His associate dean of engineering from Stanford was one of my closest friends still is done Grace who really built the, a lot of what is now the Georgia Tech Research says that or GTR, right. 

But he was an individual. I still always would address is Dr. PEDOT how afraid of Kang Chao, right? 

Uh, no way. No way. Dr. Adler hoc asking about it. Too much story. I will tell you bet George stories. I first met George when I first came here and we have to connect too much credit, George Griffith. And I always called him Dean Griffin. I never called him like he was considerably more mature than me obviously. 

But we found we had a joint interest in railroads. 

And so George would send me over here railroad books that look like they had been through at least five wars that I don't know what was holding them together, but I I appreciate it. Um, but I got to know him quite well. I ultimately taught his grandson, George, the gorge Griffin the second or third. I don't know. It was his gradual know whatever. 

His daughter-in-law, his son's wife, helped her in organizing an opening and even named her store clothing store, which is right next to 103 West up on paces ferry. And that's Peggy graph and his daughter-in-law. 

So I've been close to the growth and family over the years. 

And I have many Griffin stories to tell, like I could tell Bobby Dodd stories, but one Griffin's story nobody else will tell. 

I have a colleague that I brought here by the name of Geoff Colvin, who is Professor Coben, strategic management, who is one of the outstanding hires I think Georgia Tech's ever made, and both personality and academic ability. And late in the day, I have a habit of loving to go to the Student Center. I love ARA, Aramark food. 

I love the students that are Roger rarely considers me a definite public relations plus, but I loved to go over there and eat it even though when I get home, my wife as well aware, no matter which he's fixed for dinner that I will have eaten before she if there's food around I eat it, I should weigh about £3 million. 

But at any rate, Maryland, I loved to go over there and Jeff off it goes with well, last winter, it was last winter. We would go over there frequently and it was cold weather. And I would see this man sitting on a bench outside the Center for the Arts. And every day. And I finally said to Jim, at poor homeless guy, I feel so sorry for him. Can't we do cent, he says Fill, That's a statue of George graph and I thought it was really a person. I didn't know it was George. 

I did I didn't know who I think you know, when I when I said my goodness, it's that life-like, but that was George and I thought that it was a homeless person. 

But when you rent to be an essential Oh, I saw George, but I never looked that close, you know. And I mean, that was taken by two stories. Jeff and I both were taken by the other one. That's when the technique came out on April wasn't an April Fool's addition. There was regular edition saying that they're going to have directional patterns. You could use them the steps in the student center. 

And if you didn't use them, you would get fined, you get a ticket, get find both Jeff and I believe that but there is one hat plus but Jeff Jeff and I both were taken there, but Jeff correct me that just was not a homeless person. This was George Griffin. 

But they're kind of interesting because I am one of the trustees or board members of the Center for the Arts, but I'd never looked at that statue. 

So from Latin edition to the camera for tradition Liao. You mean that statue of George, George grief. 

And yet there's so many stories and of course I've heard many from the family with his grandson, my student, and his daughter-in-law I worked with. 

So thank to find he's probably our most be loud. 

He was very well thought of there is stiffness, Cities helped and the students that he did things for. 

So his other grandson page came here the master's program. I didn't teach him, but I know him well. He was Virginia undergrad, so I know the family quite well and they're a great family. 

Well, let's move along the chronological Let's move back into the eighties. Okay. For me now, yes, he he was ill but he still was a strong leader. We knew who the boss was at Georgia Tech, let's put it like that. 

And I worked with them as chair of the impartial Board of Review, and I hit him convinced that there should be an ombudsman, a tech overall that I should be yet and I thought it was all of a sudden I was going to be that knows that. And they said no, just stays chair the impartial board of review. 

But it was through that time, Clive Robins and I did the report. We did the parking on the Tech campus and whatever. 

Well, we move now into a new era. 

It's an era of further research growth, dynamic growth in general, more outstanding students coming out to become prominent alumni like think of the Richards boys over it South where they're coming AT. 

So many young people still are reaching top level positions very early because I think a lot of influence and Georgia Tech on their lives. 

But about this time, there were some interesting developments that the Athletic Association and being a trustee down there and being close to those people over the years and feeling that I did mentioned to you before, I said there are three elements that I think make Georgia Tech a distinct institution. One is the achievement of our alum's based on what, hopefully we've got a mirror to our research. 3 is our intercollegiate athletics. It is very important to Georgia Tech and we have been super successful. 

We've been to every ballgame, every boll, we've been very successful and we've had a husband and Alexander died. And then one of my own students carry. 

So we've had a lot of the man that the state has been developed because of the success of our student athletes in the professional area where we don't have any place for them to hide. They can hide. 

A lot of them are my classes and you talk to any of my students, they'll find you don't hide my classes. 

So we are Athletic Association very important to us. 

Well, about this time, we basketball, we weren't doing anything. 

I had never gone to a basketball game at Georgia Tech, never, never, even though it was here, a number of my students, which is unusual because I usually see my students perform, whether it's in the band, whether it's drama tech, or whether it's on the athletic field, I'll go to see them. 

But I was not overly enthusiastic about the coaching or anything going on there. 

But then we got new coach by the name of Bob increments. 

And I read in a campus publication where faculty children could attend his summer camp that he was going to put on. You just been a year, a month. It was late winter, I think. 

And if that faculty children could come to summer camp that coming summer at a discount? 

Well, I had a son, my oldest son at that time who was about in the seventh or eighth grade and your ideal. 

So I went down to meet him. I was the first faculty member to ever meet Bobby. 

And today I would say that if I number, uh, three or four of my closest friends, Bobby credits is one of them. And what he has done for Georgia Tech is beyond anything that anyone could say. 

Not just because of the success of his teams, but because of his own personality and charisma, he has given Tech a lighter image that goes with our heavier image of academics and research. And he has just been incredible. And I, my dad now we've got Georgia Leary who is of the same quality. And of course we had Bobby Rossi was great, but we couldn't keep Bobby. He went to the products but we got George back. 

And I've talked to your daughter and I know the family and we're George and and Bobby Clemens do something for Georgia Tech. Whether they win or whether they lose, they do something for the school. That cannot be done by any professor or any alum. 

And it's to further the mystique and unique distinction of Georgia Tech as an institution of higher learning. 

So that both of them are that about? 

I mean, you know, I can tell stories about Bobby. You would not believe it, but now you probably shoot me if I did some of them flanked it. 

Well, I tell you one and like this is well known witness Blackboard in his office. You've got we've got to improve RTT's. 

Well, what are teachers while I finally find out their treat rose, better known as vowel shy, so refrigerators. 

But Bobby is one of the most wonderful people I have ever met in my life. 

Truly one of the most remarkable and wonderful people and I could tell many stories I love to think about is three trips. Yeah, that's pretty but, you know, Bobby has its own language. He got that. He has his own it isn't New York language. 

It's Bobby crowning his language, but he is one of the most wonderful people that I've ever met in my life. And I think that was ever said no at all feel that way good to be actually always good to everybody. He is genuine. It, nothing phases him. He could be President of the world and he would not change. And Georgia, Larry's like that too. We're very, very fortunate. We've had some wonderful coaches here. 

But Bobby is a distinct individual. And as I say, one of the most wonderful people I've ever met in my life. I love the guy and he will always be one of my closest friends. And I'm much older, much, much older. I'm 25 years older than Bobby. 

But the athletic part of Georgia Tech intercollegiate athletics has done a lot for us and buys is done incredible work. I also want to give a few plotted here to Johnson, our band director. What he has done with that band and for Georgia check is just incredible. It just absolutely incredible. 

And we keep adding neat things, cultural thing, the Center for the Arts and Missy routable now as our chair, I don't know if Missy and she gave me this buzz that I'm wearing, it probably doesn't show up in the picture. 

She is Robert Woodruff, straight, nice, and messy is just done so much to develop our Center for the Arts, which is good for the students and for the faculty. 

And you know, we're bringing things to this campus and just two or three weeks to New York City Opera is coming back. 

It's all part of giving us a complete get an H, an institution of higher learning that can do everything. And he has done everything. And so we just continue to grow in stature and every which way. How did you feel after keyframe here? 

Well, Pat and I got along very, very well. Some people didn't, but I did. And it was simply because of the fact that I never I was never a closed social friend. 

I was in his house one time, the president's house, when he brought Norman Johnson down to meet a very private dinner to consider bringing Norman Campus. Only time I was ever on the President's house. 

But I felt he was a great leader. Like any human. He has frailties. We all have frailties, but I felt he was a great leader and I will always think highly of him. Always think highly of him. He changed to be brought change and people don't handle change well. 

But he he said another person, you you didn't have to play Hail to the Chief two petri sign. He didn't need you to glorify him. All he needed was to see growth and carry out a vision for an institution of higher learning. 

And I thought he was a great president, and I always will think he's a great president and we were close professionally and socially. I never had any interaction with him to speak of. 

But and for the scientists that were Brian well, I think I would leave that one to say, what perspective you're talking about. There are various ways you could talk about these changes. 

But he certainly was a dynamic visionary. And you look across the street and you see that Aquatic Center in back of us. And those are the kinds of things that came from pet great sign. And sure things he would do were controversial. 

There's no question that there were those who would not feel good about him because he brought changed dramatic challenges. Change is difficult for humans. 

We have security in the end, it's a security blanket, the old way of doing things we'd ever know when change takes place, what will happen to us in time makes pertain to see fear and it can. 

But again, people have to re-learn and think, rethink how they are operating in the world when there's change. And so it was a difficult period. 

But I think he's a great man, a great president, and I will always be in admire a petri son, Dr. Adler. Um, I think like for me to ask you if you take some pride and spreadsheets, check it. Yeah. Yes. You do. Well. Great, buster. Obviously, I've been here, I'm going into my 35th year here and I didn't leave. 

I had opportunities to and although I'd say the Emory Medical joint appointment was one of the things helped me. What really helped me was Georgia Tech. The school is very much part of me. I'm 65 years old and I'm going into my 35th year here. 

So you know, it's been a big part of my life. I will do anything I can for the school. 

And now at this particular point, we have a, an organization with two great deans, Dean Bob Hawkins, the Allen College, and our Cray up, the Dean of the School of Management. 

We're school again now under the crease sign reorganization, there Great Danes were doing big things and we're getting a lot of notoriety in the School of Management. We're very proud of what we're doing here is we're proud of Georgia Tech. 

So she had to go back to that point. You still get our needs met an expense plan far we're on striving. You read, drank like cacti. 

If I had it to do over, I would the only thing I wouldn't do over, I wouldn't go for a PhD again, I don't see how I ever how I am if I Hadoop endure going through a PhD program again, I think I want to stay to Westinghouse. 

But like I say, it's different today, but we religion literally pledge, I think I can I mean, that was very that was a complex period coursework language work dissertation. It was very, very difficult. In workload and pressure. 

The academics were not that tough, but the work you had to do was, but I think that I would without any question say that my life is Georgia Tech. My wife, my sons, two of my sons went here. And what I'm went to Southern Tech. I've involved here and various things. 

I'm advisor to fight delta theta fraternity to Alpha Chi Omega sorority and Alpha Kappa side professional business fraternity. 

Yeah, I'm an owner, a very proud of being as I told the people attending when I was made an honorary alum, that that's the only way I could become an alum here on earth. I probably couldn't pass my own courses. 

But I'm very proud of my students say have done well in life. Then they come back constantly to visit. 

And many of them are on our genes boards, which I am the Director of, Coordinator, whatever you want to call it, external affairs for the School of Management. 

And I see yours, former students giving back a lot of things to Georgia Tech, which is very high and is I'm just proud of their accomplishments. 

I'm proud of Georgia Tech and I will I will always be, as I said earlier, I'm first and Air Force colonel. 

But you might say I'm an Air Force colonel at Georgia Tech. And that's fine. Thank you very, very much. Thank you. Maryland interview. Thank you.