BENDER: Hey, what the hell are you doing with my head? PROFESSOR FARNSWORTH: Quiet, you. I'm installing an empathy chip. FRY: And that'll allow Bender to feel other people's emotions? PROFESSOR FARNSWORTH: Yes, if by "allow," you mean force. [LOUD CLANKS] BENDER: Ooh! Ow! Son of a-- PROFESSOR FARNSWORTH: Oh, dear. BENDER: Careful with that! PROFESSOR FARNSWORTH: Oh, my. BENDER: Hey! Oh! Ow! PROFESSOR FARNSWORTH: Oh, once more. BENDER: Ah! Oh! PROFESSOR FARNSWORTH: My bad. BENDER: Professor! PROFESSOR FARNSWORTH: Steady now. BENDER: Ow! PROFESSOR FARNSWORTH: There we go. [TINKERING] Now, I'll simply tune it to Leela's emotional frequency. BENDER: My god, I'm overcome with feelings. [MUSIC PLAYING] CHARLIE BENNETT: You are listening to WREK Atlanta. And this is Lost in the Stacks, the research library rock and roll radio show. I'm Charlie Bennett, in the virtual studio with everybody and more. It's Alison Valk, Ameet Doshi, Wendy Hagenmaier, Amanda Pellerin, Marlee Givens, Fred Rascoe, and me again. Each week on Lost in the Stacks, we pick a theme and then use it to create a mix of music and library talk. Whichever you are here for, we hope you dig it. AMEET DOSHI: That's right, Charlie. Today's show is called "Empathy Bytes VIP." That's "Empathy" with an E and "Bytes" with a Y. FRED RASCOE: And some very important people that are researching communities while documenting individual experiences through oral history and designing innovative ways of sharing these stories with a broad audience. MARLEE GIVENS: While the students are indeed very important folks in this case, the "VIP" stands for "Vertically Integrated Project." The Georgia Tech VIP provides undergraduate and graduate students the opportunity to enhance their college experience through engagement with long-term and multidisciplinary project teams that are led by faculty, including library faculty. CHARLIE BENNETT: It may surprise many of you to learn that librarians and archivists do more than collect and organize information, and give side eye to those talking too loudly, or in this day and age for not wearing a mask in the library buildings. More and more, we find ourselves front and center in the classroom. WENDY HAGENMAIER: In VIP, teams of students from various years disciplines and backgrounds work with faculty and graduate students in their areas of scholarship and exploration. Alison Valk, tech's multimedia instruction librarian, and Amanda Pellerin, Georgia Tech's University archivist, are passionate about using technology for the greater good, centering human connection and creative design and spotlighting underrepresented groups. They began co-teaching the Empathy Bytes VIP section in the spring semester of 2019. ALISON VALK: The class spun out of the Everyday Georgia Project, which was a collaboration between the Georgia Tech Library and the Institute For People and Technology. Everyday Georgia explored the stories of people touched by Georgia Tech's research and technology initiatives through a coupling of portrait style photography and interviews. In addition to an interactive exhibit that occurred in the spring of 2018, Everyday Georgia has an online presence through the Georgia Tech Library with support through a grant from the Institute of Museum and Library Services. The Georgia Tech Library has preserved the project's audio and artwork in its special collections and archives, which maintains the historical records of the institute. AMANDA PELLERIN: In the Empathy Bytes VIP course, undergraduate students earn academic credit for their work and have direct experience with the innovative process, while the library benefits from the extended efforts of the team. CHARLIE BENNETT: I mean, it's a win all around. AMEET DOSHI: Our songs today are about empathy and technology, immersive spaces and deeper understanding. And we start with a track about reflecting on intergenerational dilemmas like hate and death and war. This is "The Question" by The Moody Blues right here on Lost in the Stacks. [THE MOODY BLUES, "QUESTION"] AMANDA PELLERIN: You just heard "The Question" by The Moody Blues. This is Lost in the Stacks. And for today's show, Alison and I spoke with students in our Empathy Bytes VIP class. We asked them to tell us about the project and why they decided to join the team. ALISON VALK: All right, Jocelyn, I guess we're going to kick off with you. Maybe for people who are not familiar with Georgia Tech's VIP program, can you tell us a little bit about the VIP program and what about it appealed to you? JOCELYN KAVANAGH: Sure. So I'm Jocelyn Kavanagh I am a third year music technology student. And the VIP program is-- so the acronym is "vertically integrated project." And they're basically a conglomeration of a whole bunch of research projects across the university. There's probably 80 or more. There's so many, so many options that people can join. And they're faculty-led, large-scale, multi-semester projects. And they have a bit of a focus away from faculty research. They have more of a focus on real world. And when you talk more casually with students about it, the research is more of the academic side. If you do faculty research, that's academic. But the VIPs are more like if you were in industry or you're in a small startup, so that's kind of what the VIPs are looking like. And something that's really important about them and what appealed to me is they're all about being multidisciplinary, so they're multidisciplinary teams. So for example in our project, we have CS majors, we have LMC, we have music tech, myself. And so we're all trying to bring together all of these different ideas. My core fundamental is being multidisciplinary and taking what's interesting about the arts and what's interesting about science. And so that's something that I really appreciate about the VIP program and one of the main appeals for me. The only other appeals for me was I wanted a way to have some real research, some real project outside of my coursework. And to be perfectly honest, this seemed less scary to enter than faculty research. I don't know why. I felt like there was some kind of barrier to entry, whereas this, I felt like I could start my way. I had mentorship in the beginning. And then as I've been with the project-- this is my second semester in the project-- I now have a leadership role. So there's a lot of room for growth, a lot of room for your individual contributions. If I have ideas, I can present them to the group and try to move forward with them. Those are my main-- I really like the VIP program, and those are the highlights for me so far. AMANDA PELLERIN: Great, thank you. Harsha, this one's coming to you. Why did you decide to join the Empathy Bytes project specifically? HARSHA KARANTH: My name is Harsha Karanth. And I'm a second year computer science student. So the thing that interested me most about joining the team is that I like to create software. I like to create software that represents like a community at Georgia Tech. Like, for me, it's really important because software is the easiest way for people to gain knowledge on other sorts of information. And by creating software that represents a community, people can understand the traditions and values about the community and can be involved in it if they're interested in it as well. Additionally, I joined the Empathy Bytes team because I was interested in mobile development. I created Android apps and iOS apps, mainly Android apps before, but I was really interested in iOS apps like right now. So this is like a way for me to use my creative process to create a new product. And it's very beneficial to highlight a community. And like in this case, we're focusing on the makerspace. So it was interesting to me to get involved in the community here because currently-- I was a transfer student, so I really didn't like know much of Georgia Tech. So this process really helped me like, oh, this is like a really cool resource if I wanted to come in the future. And I understood like what went on with the makerspace like last Friday when we took a tour, so-- last Wednesday when we took the tour. So it was really helpful for me to be involved in the community and also learning software and good software practices along the way. ALISON VALK: Thank you. Jocelyn, tell us a little bit about the Empathy Bytes project and what it hopes to accomplish. JOCELYN KAVANAGH: Yeah, so the Empathy Bytes project is-- I guess you could boil it down to an oral history project but so much more. So oral history is collecting stories, basically, from different communities and different people. Specifically, we focus on the Georgia Tech community, different hidden community. So for example, we do the makerspace community this semester, and then upcoming the following semesters, we'll be doing the dance community. And so we take these oral histories, these interviews with people, listening to their stories, listening to their experiences, and then our goal is to augment them with technology. So by using virtual reality and augmented reality, we're trying to really push the idea of this buzzword of "empathy." So we're trying to deepen the understanding that people can have with these communities beyond just reading about them. Reading about them is not nearly as connective as-- for makerspace tours, Harsha had mentioned the user can enter the space, physically enter the space in this virtual world. And so then hearing people's personal accounts on top of that, that's really our goal is just to promote this deeper understanding, promote empathy and bring together the Georgia Tech community. AMANDA PELLERIN: How has working on this project caused you to explore topics or research technology in a way that you didn't expect? JULIET ORTH: I'll take this one. So my name is Juliet Orth. I am a third year industrial and systems engineering major. And this is my first semester on the Empathy Bytes VIP. And I would say that this question for me reminded me of the work that we put in the beginning of the semester, specifically those of us that were new to the project. We spent a couple of weeks going into depth about what is virtual reality, what is augmented reality, and how do both of those technologies interact with the idea behind our Empathy Bytes program, that we are going to seek these unknown communities on our campus and let their stories and voices be heard. And from there, I learned all about the fact that these programs and technologies have been utilized around the world in capacities that I was completely unfamiliar with, including the fact that it's now the relationship between Google Tango, which is the official Google augmented reality software is now being implemented in the National Museum of Singapore, which is crazy to think about. And the fact that visitors can come and use the Google Tango app in order to see all of the museum exhibits come to life in a way that we are unable to experience the classic museum in almost a museum renaissance, the technological museum of today. So the idea that these technologies are coming together to bring forth a new age of experience, a new age of, in a word, again, the buzzword, Jocelyn referred to "empathy," and the fact that we have a new way of interacting with the world around us and acquiring knowledge, and acquiring stories using the technologies of today was something that really excited me about this project. And it's something that I see consistently in our research as well as in the research going on around us. FRED RASCOE: This is Lost in the Stacks. And we'll get back to our conversation with the students of the Empathy Bytes VIP class after a music set. SPEAKER: File is set under QA76.9.H85. [MUSIC PLAYING] WENDY HAGENMAIER: ...just heard "Down in the Park" by Tubeway Army, and before that was "Deep Shimon" by Shimon the Robot, Georgia Tech's very own. Those were songs about the intersections of technological mechanisms and human emotion. [MUSIC PLAYING] MARLEE GIVENS: This is Lost in the Stacks. And on today's show, we're talking with the students in the Empathy Bytes VIP class, which is co-taught by Georgia Tech Library's Amanda Pellerin and Alison Valk. ALISON VALK: The building blocks for our class are stories of community on campus. Amanda and I talked to the students about how they identify these groups and capture their individual and collective experiences through oral histories. We also touched on how technology fosters empathy and brings people together. Juliet, so through this project, we understand your exploring unique communities on campus. Is there any one story or interesting fact that you found out that stands out to you? JULIET ORTH: I would want to preface this question with the fact that before I joined this research project, I had only ever interacted with the makerspace community through the tour guides and through giving tours to visiting guests and their families and saying, oh, there's the makerspace, there's the invention studio, people do stuff there, I have no idea really what, but if you come to Georgia Tech, you can learn all about it. And so through these interviews, I would say the major facts that I've collected in story that I've been able to hear over and over again, and I'll share a few, is the fact that there is an underground community of inventors and creators who congregate in these different spaces, these makerspaces on campus, and are able to both pursue their major and pursue their passion while also making deep friendships and creating a community that it may not be something that every single person on campus knows about, but when you have the chance to be a part of it, you'll find that it's really welcoming and it's here for you of any major or of any background. So one story that I want to share is of my last interview that I conducted. It was with someone that had actually taken on a leadership role within the invention studio. And her story of how she became someone involved with the makerspace is actually really interesting to me. And I actually had a chance to talk to her before our interview just to get to know each other. And this was when she shared with me that she'd actually come on to campus as an out-of-state student who felt as if her really only interesting fact was that she knew how to build robots and interact with machinery that the people at her high school thought was too nerdy or they weren't super interested in hearing about. And so one day while she went to our org fair on campus, she'd been interacting with someone who said, hey, I'm a part of so-and-so club, but my major passion on campus is the invention studio. I'm a part of the organization. I've sought leadership roles, and I highly recommend it. You should come by and use some of our tools. And she ended up coming every single week and using the water jet and then taking on an apprenticeship role and then taking on an executive role, and really realizing that there was a community that would let her-- and I'm putting this in air quotes-- and "nerd out" and really create community around her passions while also being interested in getting to know her as an individual. And I think that that is the most interesting part to me about the makerspace is the fact that we have these machines that are for use to student and faculty in our community, but there's also a depth of community that is waiting to be found there and friendship that you can make while exploring these passions. ALISON VALK: And what about exploring these communities fosters empathy? JULIET ORTH: I would say that in particular for the makerspace that I was just reflecting on and then I'd show another one. For the makerspace specifically, the idea that the makerspace is open to every single year, every single major, both student and faculty all free of use creates a space where people from different backgrounds and perspectives are naturally going to congregate. And when spaces are open to the entire community versus having a certain type of person who comes or a person of a certain background be able to attend, you're naturally going to foster a space that lends itself to empathy and to the idea that we can share our stories because we are different and because we're coming to this space with different backgrounds and passions. And I think the makerspace is a great example of that through the idea that one of our interviews with Dane. He was a mechanical engineer who had transferred over into the computer engineering sphere. And then Danielle, she's naturally a mechanical engineering major, but it was through her work with the makerspace, through the invention studio that she actually was interested in getting a finance certificate because she learned that she loved finance through her executive role. So the idea that you're meeting people with different passions that are giving you the experience and potential to find out these things about you, these interests and dislikes that you may not have noticed unless you'd spoken to someone that had them through this space that has such open doors. And then I would say one other space that really we're going to tackle later in this year is with the dance community. And through my recent research in the dance community, I believe this space offers that exact same potential for students through, again, making sure that from the start, this is a space that welcomes any major, any year, student and faculty. So we're opening up every single door. And a lot of these clubs, one example, and one that I didn't even know we had until I researched was the GT Ballroom Club that is open to every single person that steps on to Georgia Tech's campus, even visitors. And they're highly involved in community outreach. And I just would say that to some, this answer entirely would be any space where every single door is open, you are naturally going to find that empathy is fostered simply because you're exposing yourself to different perspectives, personalities, and experiences. AMANDA PELLERIN: What makes oral histories and this interview process rewarding? What makes it different than, say, just reading about someone or something? SAMINA PATEL: Hello. I'm Samina Patel. And I'm a first year aerospace engineering major. So to me, what makes oral histories and this interview process so rewarding is how with oral histories, you gain a personal insight into that individual's experiences in life. And you are able to learn things you would have never realized before. Through Empathy Bytes, I actually had the opportunity to interview Dr. Di Leo, the faculty advisor for the aero makerspace, and it was an incredible experience. To be able to talk with him personally and learn about why he got involved with the makerspaces allowed me to realize the huge impact this community has at Georgia Tech. Interviewing Dr. Di Leo one-on-one helped me gain a much better understanding about his role in the makerspace community than it did by just reading his description on the aero makerspace website. So like as Jocelyn mentioned, before reading about something second-hand doesn't really have the same impact and same effect as hearing it from that person themselves. This interview process and oral histories, they help to build empathy and it connects us all together and allows us to understand each other more clearly. And at the end of the day, I think that's what makes it so rewarding. FRED RASCOE: We'll be back with more of our interview with the Empathy Bytes VIP class on the left side of the hour. [MUSIC PLAYING] ATTICUS: Hi, this is Atticus. You are you listening to Lost in the Stacks. Party starts in the library. Rock and roll radio show, at WREK Atlanta. [SOFT LAUGH] CHARLIE BENNETT: Empathic technology is only as empathetic as its creators. Flexing conscious awareness muscles in developing technology products has the ability to improve human connection, building shared experiences over distant spaces. But don't take our word for it. Listen to what one student had to say about the empathy technology takeaways they've had after the semester. ALISON VALK: How can technology be used to increase empathy or improve the human condition? What is the intersection between empathy and emerging technologies? SPEAKER: My name is [INAUDIBLE]. I'm a first year computer science major. And as we all know, our technology has had an immense impact on everything around us. And I think [INAUDIBLE] is a great potential in empathy building as well. Traditionally, we've learned to put ourselves in other's shoes by direct conversation, reading, and more recently like watching television and films. And oftentimes, what happens with these traditional ways of empathy building is like when you read about a particular thing, or when you hear a particular thing, and you sort of develop your hypothetical response to that particular situation, you don't take into consideration some very significant environmental-related factors because when you are present in that situation, there are a lot of things that have to be factored in. And so many of the responses that seem like so very obvious at first, they don't really strike you at that point or aren't really feasible because after all, our faulty thinking patterns actually seem very reasonable ways to deal with impossible problems. What technology does is it bridges this disconnect between people and sort of fosters a sense of rapport. AR, VR technology helps you to step into someone's else's shoes and like witness and interact with things from their perspective. So it can be helpful, like, for example, like children suffering from social anxiety, they can use VR tech to develop their self-image and to rehearse situations in which empathy is typically formed. And also like technologies like haptic tech, which takes the immersive to the next level as it allows for tactile perception as well. So you can sort of feel things. And it takes basically-- like AR, VR technologies enable us to experience things in a visual sort of way, but it enables for a tactile perception as well. And then there are newer technologies like immersive reality that go beyond cognitive empathy into like effective empathy, so sort of like the emotional empathy. It enables you to encounter the harsh realities of things like prejudices and stereotypes and sort of you get take it all in mentally. And I think like technology happens is like this great potential into like preventing this ideological polarization and establishing a sense of affinity between people. FRED RASCOE: File this set under PZ5.G3165. [MUSIC PLAYING] ALISON VALK: You just heard "Probably Up" by Lawrence, a song about gathering stories from people you relate to. [MUSIC PLAYING] WENDY HAGENMAIER: You are listening to Lost in the Stacks. Today, we're hearing from students in the Empathy Bytes VIP class, co-taught by our Georgia Tech Library colleagues Alison Valk and Amanda Pellerin. AMANDA PELLERIN: A major component of our project is to create immersive experiences so that a virtual passerby will simultaneously hear in interviewee's words and sense aspects of that story to build empathy. We asked the students to reflect on what they had learned about the technology empathy connection during their time with the project. Let's start off with just kind of hearing a little bit about the technologies that you all are utilizing. MOLLY BRIGHAM: Yeah. Hi, my name is Molly Brigham. And I'm a second year computer science major. So one of the great things about this project is we really get to explore and interact with a lot of different sorts of technology. So for the project, we're using Xcode to create a mobile application in the emerging technologies track. And Xcode's been really useful and interesting to use because it allows you to write your code and then simulate what that will look like on an iOS device. You can even plug-in your own phone into the computer and have it open as an app on your phone. And then this semester, as we're sort of diving in further into mobile development, we're really exploring the fields of augmented reality and virtual reality. For example, we use an app called 3D Scanner, which allows you to scan an object and go around it and basically get a 3D rendition of the object, and the user can move it around with their hands and see all the different angles of it, zoom in, et cetera. And then additionally, there also some other technology we've been experimenting with. One that comes to mind is Matterport capture. This technology basically allows you to do a larger scale of that. So doing a 360 of a room and being able to zoom in and out of it and see every single component that makes up a room, the reason that this has been useful is last week we actually did a tour of the makerspace, The Hive on campus. So we got to see all the different rooms they had. So like for example, one is basically full of 3D printers. So we really got to experience that room and then look back at the images and the 360 scans that we took and have it feel as if we were in that room still. So that's been a really interesting technology to use. We're still experimenting with a lot of different technologies. One that comes to mind is Sketchfab is one I was experimenting with, which would allow you to import a scan and edit it with lighting, cropping it, adding sounds, components that would allow the user to really have the immersive experience we want them to. ALISON VALK: From your perspective, what types of technologies have the most promise in helping us understand one another? SPEAKER: Yeah. Hi, I'm [INAUDIBLE], and I'm a second year computer science major. And I think one of the most important aspects of understanding one another is becoming aware of like the various cultures and backgrounds that people come from. So when it comes to new and emerging technologies, we are now better able to do this specifically with AI and AR, VR technology, and the latter being what this project is about. I think being able to visualize and surround oneself with the environment of someone else gives a completely new and eye-opening perspective. We are now able to experience major humanitarian causes as if we were present in that moment. A very significant example of this technology being used was in the 2015 VR campaign, allowing its audiences to step into the shoes of a little girl in a refugee camp. With experiences that are so sensational like this one, people not only experience the climate at the time but also a different age, gender, race, and overall life of this little girl. Similarly, in this VIP, we want to capture the various communities of Georgia Tech so that the student body is more aware of the cultures on campus, and they get to experience all the places of the world that students have come from, considering that we have so many international students here at tech. So I think these immersive technologies and the use of big data and AI allows people to further understand one another and foster empathy. ALISON VALK: How do the community interviews and the emerging technologies this group is using complement one another towards the project goals? JOCELYN KAVANAGH: OK, so I'm Jocelyn Kavanagh. So I think that these two complement each other, both the community interviews and the emerging technologies complement each other because I think that they could only function together. Now, you can have an oral history project outside of the emerging tech that we add in, but to be perfectly honest, it's still pretty passive. You're listening and you're experiencing someone's story, yes, and so that does add an extra layer to reading, but in the research that I've done, the thing that really promotes empathy and fosters empathy within a user is having some kind of interactive element, some kind of feedback as either haptic feedback, visual feedback, as a user was talking about. So having the two together, you're pushing forward past, and an oral history, past a podcast to putting that person-- our favorite phrase is putting someone into someone else's shoes, you're doing that specifically with the emerging tech. And on the flip side, if you had just the emerging tech without the full research of the community and without the individual voice of these people in the communities, so these individual stories, is it more superficial potentially without those voices? So I think the two of them together build on top of each other. They would be fine separately, but not nearly as engaging and not nearly as successful at reaching the goal of fostering empathy. ALISON VALK: What has been the most rewarding aspect of the project? And also, have you discovered any new tools or technologies through research in the project? HARSHA KARANTH: So for the latter question, like new technologies I've learned, I've learned a new technology like Swift for creating native mobile apps. Before this process, I used to physically, like, program the UI elements in the editor. But during this process, I learn new ways to manage UI elements, I found new ways to maintain the information. For example, I created like documentation for like iOS. I used 3D modeling software like Matterport for paving the scans. We're experimenting with Google Cardboard, which is a way to insert the 360 virtual tours we took of the makerspace into the iOS mobile app. And I think that's my most rewarding thing on this team because like I'm figuring out new technologies that I can use in my own personal projects and also ways to improve the community as well by researching these products and software. AMANDA PELLERIN: How does this project incorporate technical communication into its work output? LAWRENCE WILLIAMS: Sure, I can take this question. Hi, I'm Lawrence Williams, second year computer science major. Technical communication is absolutely necessary for this project and for VIPs in general. It's kind of baked in to everything we do. For example, we all keep weekly notebooks that document the processes that we go through during the week. So any time we encounter a new technology, we're writing down what we did with it and how it was used and what we can learn from it, and this information is shared throughout the team. We have a shared notebook space of our VIP, where we can exchange this information so that everyone can be on the same page. And going further, our VIP also documents our entire process, so everything from technical aspects involving our app or our interview processes that is technically documented not just for the team but also for others who are interested in what we're doing through our team wiki page. And again, all of this documentation that we're doing is kind of necessary for the team to move forward. The team gets new members every semester. And some semesters, we have members who leave either because they're graduating. And this documentation ensures that everyone is able to stay on the same page as we're working toward our goals. [MUSIC PLAYING] FRED RASCOE: File this set under BF575.E55E57. [MUSIC PLAYING] MARLEE GIVENS: You just heard "Someone, Somewhere" by The Dog That Bit People, and before that, "Empathy" by Hikes, songs about looking for and finding a deeper understanding. [MUSIC PLAYING] AMEET DOSHI: Today's show was all about the Empathy Bytes Vertically Integrated Project section. We spoke to co-instructors Alison Valk and Amanda Pellerin about the strategies the class uses to inform radically empathetic immersive technologies to build human connection. AMANDA PELLERIN: You know, Georgia Tech has a long history of integrating hands-on learning to reinforce classroom theories with on-site shop work and work study programs. ALISON VALK: We provide them with a framework, but one of the most rewarding aspects of teaching this class is watching the students take ownership of the project and capitalize on the opportunity to explore their own interests and develop new skills. Has anyone here had a similar educational experience like the VIP program that has left a lasting mark? AMEET DOSHI: I always tell my students to look into study abroad because when I studied abroad in Normandy, France, I had the opportunity to speak with some veterans that had participated in the Battle of Normandy, the Normandy invasion during World War II, so that certainly left a lasting mark. Charlie? CHARLIE BENNETT: Well, this goes against the idea of preparing for the workforce, but I was part of a Moby Dick class as the embedded librarian, where we learned all the technology in Moby Dick, like making barrels, and black-smithing a harpoon, and making hardtack. Not stuff you want to apply to the real world, but it was definitely hands-on. FRED RASCOE: What comes to mind in my hands-on educational experience is a geology field trip that I took as an undergraduate when I still had some delusions of being a geology major. I did not do well in a lot of my science classes, but in that particular field trip, we spent all day at a single location, drawing, mapping, making observations in our field notebook, filling a field notebook full of information. And it was one time in my brief science academic career when everything sort of came together and I really saw the rock formation and the history of it and how it formed, because we were there actually looking at it, touching it, and studying it. WENDY HAGENMAIER: I think I would say just in general the opportunity to go to library school, it was so applied, a combination of applied and theoretical. And it was really that combination that was so essential to the degree. And I just had the opportunity to visit University of Texas at Austin iSchool class as an alum, a class that's working on an oral history project, actually, about the pandemic. And it was super inspiring to see how they're using this project as a way to gain practical skills that will really prepare them to become archivists and data librarians. And it was taught by former LITS guest Dr. Amelia Acker. MARLEE GIVENS: I think I'm just going to bring this full circle to back to Ameet. I too studied abroad in Normandy in France. And I remember so many experiences from that time, but the best part was that I was forced to use the French language, and that's the best learning tool of all. CHARLIE BENNETT: All right, and let's roll the credits. Fred, I think we should use some more of that Georgia Tech robot music. [MUSIC PLAYING] FRED RASCOE: You've got it. MARLEE GIVENS: Lost in the Stacks is a collaboration between WREK Atlanta and the Georgia Tech Library. And it's written and produced by Ameet Doshi, Amanda Pellerin, Charlie Bennett, Fred Rascoe, Marlee Givens, and Wendy Hagenmaier. FRED RASCOE: Today's show was edited and assembled by Charlie, with hands-on help from his children. Is that "help" in quotation marks? ALISON VALK: Legal counsel and a positive sense of place were provided by the Burrus Intellectual Property Law Group in Atlanta, Georgia. AMANDA PELLERIN: Special thanks to the students in the Empathy Bytes VIP class for being on the show, creating meaningful outcomes, and showing up for one another to do the dang thing in this semester of wildness. And thanks, as always, to each and every one of you for listening. WENDY HAGENMAIER: Find us online at lostinthestacks.org. And you can subscribe to our podcast pretty much anywhere you get your audio fix. CHARLIE BENNETT: Next week on the pandemic schedule is a rerun, but we'll be back with a new show the week after that. FRED RASCOE: It's time for our last song today. As librarians and archivists, we strive for everything we do to be centered on the human in our systems, our technologies, and in our classrooms. So let's close with a song about trying to understand ourselves and each other in order to sustain ourselves and survive. This is "Dear Humans" by Elephant Gym, right here on Lost in the Stacks. Intense, an Elephant gym. Have a great weekend, everyone. [MUSIC PLAYING]