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>> This is a living history interview with Bill Ray faculty staff at Georgia Tech between 19011997 conducted by Marilyn summers on June the 24th the year 2002 we refuse home in Atlanta Georgia and the subject of the interview today is life in general his experiences with Georgia Tech General Radio Ray What shall I call you Bill just call me very pleased your story is big and complex in more than Georgia Tech and all good stories start at the beginning so I have to ask you where were you born and we were you born let's begin there I was born in Dyersburg Tennessee in 1034 What were your folks doing in Dyersburg my father was a telephone telegraph lineman for the little I said Correll road and my middle dot dot dot that was not a fix to the wire all he actually went out and when I fixed the wires.

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And he. Was originally from Kentucky then he had. Come to Dyersburg with the railroad and my mother was raised in Dyersburg So they they were married and. Actually moved to New Orleans. Where my sister was born my older sister they lived in New Orleans for about 3 years and then back to Dyersburg and I was born 134 so he was a lineman and mama with the local girls captures so that trying to try to guide them and were there just the 2 of the children know we have a younger brother who's 8 years younger than I am that.

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You know. And were you raised in Dyersburg no. We moved actually to Red Bay Alabama. And a lot of people. Don't know where Red Bay is they all think it's close to Moby on the but actually Red Bay is in the northwest corner about Alabama it's named for the red clay and the bakery has they have those and there was a lot to do with the water and we lived in Red Bay men for till I was 10 so that's where you began your elementary education is trying for you a good student to like going to school I was a good student read Bay But then in one team 44 we moved to Vicksburg Mississippi but you're down there with the reverend there with the rabbit so he was moving with family and what happened then you'd like to go to so much I found out that I was in such a good state.

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And that was a tough year. Well we moved to move from from Red Bay which is a tiny one town to Vicksburg which then was much much larger than Red Bay and city city and it was that the change was bad and. We moved. There. After the school year had begun and then we didn't stay the whole year we moved moved from there to Jackson Tennessee and Jackson is really where I grew up because I don't think they're in the longer we got there when I was 10 and I stayed there through the remainder elementary school junior high school and high school but it was in Vicksburg that you discovered you were not quite that smart and I just thought that's right it your 1st hit in the face by reality Well it's Vic's Vicksburg and multiplication table or both kind of.

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Well thank goodness you got back to Tennessee and things settled into a small town that sounds like a jazz Jackson has about 40000 I think with a 1000 man. 3 railroads converge in Jackson or such on the Gulf mobile in Ohio. And the n.c. and say now all.

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Went through Jackson go go below how and why 2nd were north south railroads for us to do enjoy the train Yes I get to that I work as a brakeman on the steam engine hot Ok let's not rush into that I said Ok we're back in school elementary school how did you do in school when she got an a c. if you rediscover your brilliance or did you plot a lot you know I sort of slid along it was the next scene in school anymore it wasn't until I determined that my sister was really smart.

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That I had to work hard to do as well as she did and so that caused me to to begin working hard probably in that. In the 7th grade Junior High School is where you start to apply yourself that's right were you involved in athletics and I played football in junior high school 1st year they ever had I thought ball team.

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I played football. For 2 years in junior high school broke my leg 1st we're all young mother must have been just delighted she loved. Her baby boy goes out and break his leg then. Did that set you back no it. Didn't slow you down I know your career so so did didn't.

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Slow it down and the next year I played football and dance again. And high school was again in Jackson and Jackson High School Yes How you doing very well very knew how to apply yourself that's right. Where you were encouraged by your parents to go to college yes you knew your contacts yes even though neither of them went to college but they had it as a value exactly and my sister had gone to Methodist College in town.

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When I was a senior in high school my father march me down to the local congressman's office Tom Murray and asked that. Congressman Murray. Appoint me to West Point has does is that some you wanted to do well I want to get out of Jackson. Let me have what was going to be offered and but you know if you hadn't grown up thinking wow I want to go to the military No I don't know what your dad's idea and my dad was a.

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A corporal in World War one and served with the 2nd effort division in France was just south of Byrd done when the war ended and he. Treasured those memories of been a soldier and I think he wanted me to be a soldier that. And then that was your local congressman in the Able to that well.

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When my dad told him about the union vote from the railroads he became very angry was. A little it forward said Do you know why so he was nominated you were recommended to me but it's more than that is that you don't just want soon be no no you have to you have to take the test right and I took the test where did it go did you go up to West like take note of the court Knox Kentucky for when I said I can and I took a test and actually won the Act of 2 tests I passed the English and passed the math and want the aptitude test and so I did not get into West Point.

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That year and. I then went to Union University which is after graduation high school went to an university which is also in Jackson and. Played football at Union the last football team Union ever had they may have it again it's a bad College in Jackson and. During the year the congressman called and asked if I'd like to have the appointment again the next year this was during the Korean War and people were not.

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Flocking to the military as. It was a day but yeah it was a different time yeah and and and people from Jackson Tennessee didn't understand or didn't didn't particularly want to go to New York to go to school so he had another appointment and I took the exams again and passed them all again in entered was point in the fall in the spring summer of 1953 So here is a summer of $53.00 Korean War going on and you're one up to West Point had you ever lived up north you've never been on everything even though for years I never been north of Cairo Illinois So you were in there being cultures and you know try to remember what that was like to come to West Point the 1st it was a culture shock for the right word up culture shock I.

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Was one of the last people ever to ride a train to West Point and I took a train from from current Mississippi up to through Washington d.c. and in New York and arrived it. Penn Station in the middle of the night and I had to then. They spent 2 o'clock in the morning I had to walk.

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Over to the wee Hawken ferry which we came in at the foot of 42nd Street and. Took the ferry across the Hudson River to we hawk in the jersey and caught the train out to West Point and I believe that's the last year it was even the last year or the next to last year the trains even rain ran on on the west shore.

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To West Point you were leaving one era and stepping into That's exactly right. What was your 1st experience their lives early days was like it was it was really relatively easy for me the to think of because he had one year of college already well that was partially at one year of college was very important and that that helped a lot in enjoy the level of money now pretty level and adjusting to the discipline and I'd never had a problem I didn't I didn't enjoy shining my shoes and doing some of the names you had to do as a cadet but but you had to do them and they they came pretty easily with the discipline intense.

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And they were she was very and rats experience so the 1st year was very intense right it was a point their pleats and and please dear we entered on the 3rd of July 19th 53 and we weren't allowed to leave the the campus except on with the corporate jets.

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For the Army Navy game. Was only time it we left we stayed there over Christmas for yearly because that's a different time isn't it was pretty tough is it to make you a unit is that it to make people totally I believe so they changed it now so I can say that that that time that that was the right system I still believe is right but but that that rule that's really intense and was only left as a group so they were that's why you went to very necessary you know how many people were in your class year like we started off with about $850.00 I believe graduated $540.00 Ok so it's pretty good attrition rate to you're learning.

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You are able to manage academically. In a way so to speak to be learned how to focus and. So I didn't have that much trouble academically How did you like being a soldier I mean that was a thing you ever dreamed without So how did you like being as a pilot Well neighbors it was just I think it was a calling I I enjoyed it and then it was the natural thing to do it worked Ok you didn't resent the discipline no no it worked Ok And did you finish on time for years sure you're almost have options or do you think at that time you always have to finish in 4 years because if you if you fly to a course.

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And couldn't pass the exam within 2 weeks you're out there then you were out at the time they change that considerably now that that was all harsh because some very good people would fail one course and they were tested out yeah a lot of them got lost exactly but so you graduated 157 graduated 192721 what was I was.

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Like what was happening with you Well the 2nd lieutenant and baby and I got married the day after graduation where did you met her. She was from Jackson Tennessee and you say with a childhood like Zach out well not not really we we were in a wedding and 19.

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50. 4. 5455 and what you had with the long distance courtship and why you read not quite know baby it was in school in Boston that are in Massachusetts a suburb of Boston so you she was able to come down to West Point even though I could you couldn't I couldn't go up to Boston at all and I thought you wrote letters not many no no we saw one another quite often.

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So since you graduated which I think it's fairly common that you can to me is that the use of a I don't know whether the after the I graduated just to there is a flurry of weddings but if you get married up there we did get married but not in uniform and not in the Cadet Chapel where now we got married in the post chapel and I wore blue and by that time.

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I'd had a nuff discipline. Do your own little thing well it was your 1st assignment 1st assignment was after school was to why. 25th Infantry Division and 65th in today retain in Bambi 9. Her father had given her a 55 Chevrolet. Which we sold in the fall of $57.00 and bought a Renault Dauphine which is a tiny little car and we drove that across country in.

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After Christmas between Christmas and New Years in 195758 and we were due to to leave San Francisco for Hawaii. The 1st week in January 1988 Bambi was 7 months pregnant. And they wouldn't let us go on board ship instead we had to go to Travis Air Force Base and flew in a prop plane for 13 hours.

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No windows and 2 box launches. Till we. Got to whole line that was considered better that was considered a better than an ocean liner one of them that's in line. But. We lived in Hawaii and course we arrived in Hawaii on the 8th of January 19th $58.00 with no children and we left.

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In July 1951 with 3 all 300 of our real busy Hi there all 3 of our children were born in Hawaii and. The we lived in 3 different places while we were active for but one short time but the one that we all remember were sure I don't the beach and it was a great great experience and we were really bright as well I meant.

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And were you interested in what you were doing I was I was I was very fortunate in that. When I came along. You were you were able to get as much responsibility is as you were willing to take on. And so I was a platoon leader for one year and then I moved over to be put to me later in an infantry organization for year and then I was an engineer company commander for a year and a half to you would have been lovely experience lot of a lot of experience had about 12425 people working for me and soldiers working with me and we.

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Thought awfully hard we really love to why I thought very much about getting out of the service and staying there. And I went down to interview with a construction kind of big construction company Dillingham construction company and the they took me around and said. If. They showed me.

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A draft mench table and they said Now if you come to work force this is where you'll begin work and doing quantity take off at that time I had 120 people working for him 40 I said I'm not is no way to do going backwards in the army then set us to Ohio State for a master's degree which was Ok which is all right and so that we left Hawaii and went to Ohio State for.

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2 and a half years about another year and a half did they take out where you would go they did we gave preferences and the Army sent me to house paid to get a master's degree in. Civil engineering with a minor and geodesy. That the odd thing is geodes is how level or sort of a hand that's Ok but then interesting thing is that the civil engineering was in the College of Engineering and Geodesy was in the College of Arts and Sciences So the university had never heard of such a degree as a civil engineer with a minor in Geodesy but I did take several photogrammetry courses and 2 Geodesy courses was there and you enjoyed that no you didn't and so they did not enjoy it void in my memory.

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But you learned because you got your degree we worked for we had 3 kids move from a beautiful environment in Hawaii and. To Ohio where it was cold we had a tough time getting our middle son Gus to wear shoes. But he was ready for the beach again we rented a 2 bedroom house that had a full basement and the kids could ride their cry 2nd option around the basement and I think that was banned because salvation I don't know why she stayed with.

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It was the big test we were we were there during those times that was. The salaries were really low but in addition to that. Trying to to put a timetable on getting a master's degree a Spaf to the Army sent us there and said Ok you have 18 months completist degree and in 18 months and they know how stated the time you had to do the course work and write a thesis that today this figure 18 months was wrong you know and doing the research on for the for the thesis was.

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Very much a learning experience. That we got through and then what did they offer you well then we went to. Fort Belvoir Ford for a company grade officer course and then that I went to my for my 1st tour Vietnam in 106465 in Poland of course envisioned a home with 3 kids we bought a house in Alexandria Virginia and and Bambi's stated home with the 3 children.

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And you headed off to no sweat and actually I had a great job I was that. Was unique job in that because I only had sent me Doha state to get a masters degree in Geodesy everybody thought I was a map maker and so they when I went to Vietnam I became be the baes or good Vietnamese topographic company in Saigon time and an advisor to the Vietnamese National Geographic service and a lot.

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Well good line was the Summer Palace. And beautiful area that you really did have a good I had a great assignment you were out of harm's way yes yes and you served over there for one thing it's one Ok when you're back to the Cape came back in 1965 Unfortunately my brother had a come to live with us in Hawaii and he took the entrance exams to West Point in 1961 and he entered West Point in 61 so he graduated in 65 Too much before we arrived up there too for an assignment so we were there for 3 years just anything just missed him but your way back.

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Home plate for him even when I was a nice place it was a good you got assignment. Especially with children that were very pointed what happened next. They after that. What to West Point as a captain and because of that the. Increase in size of the Army during Vietnam and they did not mobilize the reserves so put those people in the regular army promotions became very fast and so within.

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Within 3 years I was on the promotion last for Lieutenant Colonel So we we finished I tour at West Point 1968 and I went to the Marine Corps Staff College in Quantico Virginia. And was promoted there to Lieutenant Colonel So that's a pretty quick time as things go in military it was yes very I'm measuring most most people would put my time in and it was simply a factor of the.

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Model. That was it was all caused by that the growth of Army grew from from less than $500000.00 I think to a $1500000.00 over about a 3 year period and so they had to promote people fast to accommodate that growth and and they did not call up the reserves and that had been in July that was.

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It was too bad so the 10 Colonel. Went to last the Marine Corps Staff College early and I left in April. And went to a couple of schools and went to Vietnam again for 2nd tour this time as a Batang commander and 35th Engineer Battalion Combat Engineer Battalion in.

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We were located in a sock sock trying Encanto Vietnam down in the delta so not his cushy previous harmony question hard largely But you were doing hard time we were the we were the southern most common ground combat unit in Vietnam and that the Fortunately we were building major road.

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But we worked all over Vietnam. All over the delta. South of Saigon. Gotten to know the area fairly well fairly well many are lost by hearing right in helicopters that's what you would never transfer cancer. How long was that tour do that was one year all year long one of the longer years of your life no doubt but looking back on and went very fast and while you're there is the gray one day at a time when you needed time and so then you finished that to be came back to the state you know we came back and again this Geodesy which seem to follow me through my career.

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Was influential in that and I was assigned to Europe on what we called at the time a repetitive command to our But but. When I got there I was informed that there were no battalions available to command but they assigned me to the headquarters of the u.s. forces in Europe.

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U.s. European Command and as the mapping and topographic officer so that was my really 3rd experience in mapping and top to progress this is not becoming a career becoming a career but it ended there really I think I served in that job for one Year 197071 and then I became a victim officer to the chief of staff of.

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Us European command the respect Lieutenant General Sutherland jock sunroom and so he was my boss for a year and then I. Became an assistant secretary of the Joint Staff for another year and we came back from from that was in Stuttgart and we came back from stick guard in 1973.

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To. The the chief of Engineers office and we lived in. Near Fairfax and again last week and how many years in that position well I was there for one year and then I was selected to go to the National War College in 1974 and so I was a student at the National War College in Washington from cheddar 4 to 75 and then all that left there and went back to the chief mention ears office 75 said the 6 From there I went to go to Colonel still a lieutenant colonel.

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I was actually selected. For Colonel and in 75 and promoted in 76 to colonel and was. Appointed are selected to be the district engineer for the Corps of Engineers in Omaha. So we moved to Omaha 976 and we were there from 76 to 79 and it was another very interesting good assignment good place to be who was good out of the sun by that time he'd he had skipped a year of college in our year of high school and he was in college at Dartmouth and so our 2 younger children.

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Moved to Omaha with us I've been Middletown. Was a senior in high school when we had to move wherever he went to know he was that he had to leave his friends and our daughter. At the time was in the. 10th grade and so she she got to complete 3 years of high school I don't know.

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It's just one of the hazards of being an Army brat that you did. Not Get Up is that they've all started out well yeah just 2nd half of the discipline that was so well after Omaha what happened after Omaha we went. Back to Europe and 979 and I was a colonel and I at that time I became the chief of force modernization for the Army in Europe and I mean for my well at the time the Army had 200 new combat systems coming in.

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And how to manage the transition from the old systems to new systems was really a complex problem a logistical problem but 1st a problem and how to how to you can just bring a tank in you had to have the right through training to operate the tank you had to have a crew trained to maintain that day and you had to have the repair parts on than to supply the tank so the command would have the big picture of problems things and make sure that all the places where they needed to but it's very difficult very difficult my boss kept asking me for a 3 dimensional analysis of this and then all honesty I was never able to give him anything but 2 dimensions and we did the Army didn't get the 3rd dimension and so the chief his vice chief of staff of the army Max Thurman came up with the 3 dimensional.

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Analysis of the problem about 3 years later but. You know what talk about hands on experience it was good you were really getting it was good and then I'd served in that job for a year and then. Became the secretary of the gen general staff which is. The sort of been the coordinator of the staff.

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For the Army in Europe and it was a very good assignment I was there for for a little over a year and the chief engineers asked me to come back and become his chief of staff and so we moved back to to Washington lived in a wonderful place as a historian you will appreciate we live in a small house that was built when the Del Carlia reservoir was built by the Corps of Engineers the Corps of Engineers operated the whatever system for the Metropolitan District of Washington and when they built the Del Carlia water treatment plant early in this sector I think maybe 920 the dogs but.

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The They've built. 5 or 6 small houses out on MacArthur Boulevard the overlook in the Potomac and we lived in one of them they were really nice unfortunately they tore in those and the shame and then what happened. Well I was there for a little over a year in then they comment on an engineer school and asked that I be assigned as the assistant count on an engineer school for Belmore budget.

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And I really didn't want to go because that meant that we had to move from my house overlooking the Potomac out to for Belmore but to another very nice house at Port Melbourne and. I became the assistant common an engineer school for a. Year and a half and then I was selected to be a brigadier general by that time no reason I was selected all of the people that I had worked with and been selected before me.

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But the only reason the younger guys that I worked with were all selected and surveyed Well I don't know about my lord. I got selected for to be a problem I don't believe. It's just true that they happen to be there and then. They the chief of Engineers the Corps of Engineers began working in Saudi Arabia in.

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Right after World War 2 Saudi Arabia was a stopover point for them when Lisa equipment moving into Russia they would go from the u.s. cross Africa to Saudi Arabia and then up over Iran into Russia. And. The airbase at dollar on Saudi Arabia was one of the main places so after the war President Eisenhower made a gift to the king of Saudi Arabia.

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An airport terminal in the Corps of Engineers was responsible for building that. And they selected. I am pay as the architect my so it was very apt how it became a and still is a very. Nice Guster representing Islamic architecture and he did a great job Well the Saudis were so impressed they then asked the Corps to stay there and help with other projects and in 1065.

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The Corps signed a military assistance agreement with the Saudis to to train the Saudi engineers to assist in the construction of their military bases and. The what other infrastructure and so by the time I got there in in 1984 that program was going down and so the chief have been juniors asked me to go toe to Saudi Arabia to take over our office there and get the corps out of Saudi Arabia.

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Ok so you were demoted were demobilization but. During 8485 I was associated with the program there 84 you 586 and 87 and during that time we completed. The headquarters for the Saudi Navy the headquarters for the. Ministry of Public Works I mean Ministry of Defense and aviation and.

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King Khalid military city which was King Khalid military said it was a major base that were used by. The u.s. forces when they attacked. Saddam Hussein in in $191991.00 actually in the total program was about $14000000000.00 And and. I was able to close it out and then. During that period and 1009.

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$185.00 the chief of Engineers asked me to go to take over the Corps of Engineer division in Europe and so I moved to Frankfurt and for $85.86 I was in charge of both the construction for the European division and they they. Saw the construction here Middle East destructive it was it was big and you were approaching 30 years of military.

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That's right. That's right were you thinking about retiring from the military that no not really Bam-Bam been a headset all along when that when it stopped being fun we would retire and you don't have a good time it was still a still fun and we enjoyed every tour you were living in so many different.

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We were moved. 22 times in 34 years. Wow that's why. We moved back to late from move from Riyadh to Frankfurt and I was in charge of the European division of the Corps of Engineers from. 1985 to 88 and then in 1988 we moved from Frankfurt Germany to Heidelberg and we lived there and from 88 to 98 were always the Army engineer and you were so brigadier general I had to but I got promoted in 88 I thought maybe that might have happened I promoted in 88 when I moved down to be the deputy chief of staff engineer for the u.s. army in Europe.

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So that took us right up to designate dorm. And which was and what year 19909990 we were we were in route back to Washington where I became the the director of military programs for the corps Visioneer which is worldwide and. We actually signed out. Of Europe in in one on vacation in France in.

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Early August of 99 and that's when the invasion of Kuwait took place and in the. By the time we got back there the u.s. was mobilizing forces in in Saudi Arabia just a little vacation that I guess and like you weren't looking That's right and you were a natural because you knew the terrain you knew everything you'd lived there so long well we know that I was back today to the Washington office.

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And in 1990 and. We Bill Miller was was the Corps of Engineer person in in Saudi Arabia he was he was the commander of the Middle East project office and he had. Several military and civilians in. In Saudi Arabia and the 1st thing that crossed my desk in Washington was reprogramming.

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Requests for $30000000.00 then President Bush never declared a national emergency in my teen 9 aren't and consequently we could only spend $200000.00 on new construction so if we wanted to spend more than 2 $100000.00 it had to be reprogrammed and that meant going back to Congress and and telling Congress here's $30000000.00 that you've appropriated and approved for these projects and we want to move that to somewhere else in this case Saudi Arabia and they.

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Reprogram projects it just fell off the books they made to get built for that's when I went in and told my boss the Saudis should pay for this and by that time the Saudis had agreed to pay for for food fuel water and transportation for u.s. forces in Saudi Arabia and I.

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Told my boss that every everywhere in the world throughout history. The host nation provides facilities for any military force from outside their country in their country that's the thing that and and that's assisting them and the Saudis should pay for the facilities and I made that he agreed and I made the argument through up the chain through the Army and the Joint Chiefs of Staff and Secretary of Defense's office everybody agreed and I thought I had one and then one Friday afternoon I received a phone call and it was the the.

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Secretary of the Joint Staff. In work for Colin Powell and he. Said there's going to be a meeting tomorrow morning at 9 o'clock with with Paul Wolfowitz who's the secretary of defense now. Undersecretary of Defense he had the same job then and. And the Saudi ambassador Prince Bandar and we would like for you to attend and so I tended the meeting the next morning and.

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The was able to sit right beside Prince Bandar and he during the course of the conversation I was a book to say Your Royal Highness you know that you don't want us to build a Fort Bragg North Carolina in your desert and the political implications of that became clear to him immediately and he said we will build all the assailant is.

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So I could move I thought that I have won another victory and walked out in an. They tell me that the general Carnes. The. Secretary of the Joint Staff. Wanted to see me and I went down to see him and he said John Powell went to the lead.

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A team to Saudi Arabia to negotiate the policies and procedures for the host nations support because the Saudis had agreed to pay for these things but they were demanding original invoices on every item again the logistics of this is just mind boggling and it was it was very interesting the kind of thing that generally speaking people are not even aware that that kind of negotiation has to go on and that that that was happening it's not like on the back page of the papers you know the thing was on the front page of the paper where they the Congress were beating the Department of Defense.

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For not getting the Saudis to pay for everything because they didn't want to pay for it but at any rate. I put a team together we had 7 people with you and we went to Saudi Arabia to negotiate the host nation support the idea was that they the they would provide these commodities if you will food fuel water trash station and facilities in can find and and and no money would change hands yet remain in place but we had paid for a lot of things are many already from the 2nd of August and we we picked a cutoff date of 1 November and so we we.

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Prepared the letter that I presented to the Saudis has said from the 2nd of August of the 1st of November you owe us $2400000000.00 This is reimbursed reimbursement money and well nobody thought that they would pay everybody thought that they barter and agreed to provide fuel to the Navy for the next 50 years anything but anything but pay well they came back that afternoon in said.

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We can pay for costs outside the kingdom of Saudi Arabia and surrounding waters. But we had another letter prepared that said For our cost in the kingdom of Saudi Arabia. And surrounding waters from the 2nd of August of the 1st of November will be $760000000.00 And then we began negotiating the process for them to provide the commodities encounter.

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Nobody ever believed that we'd see anything from from the Saudis and we were there for 2 and a half 3 weeks negotiating and one day I was outside. In the hallway waiting for the afternoon staff meeting in a Saudi brigadier general came up and tugged on my sleeve and handed me an envelope and it was addressed to his Excellency Major General Ray.

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You were his excellent and I'm never gotten bit in Bambi that way. So they have a fancy to open them all up and then enclose and there was a letter in there and said enclosed here with this is a check for $760000000.00 my word in the United States I have it downstairs optically down.

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Isn't that amazing and so I took it down and I keep saying it's hard but especially because nobody believed it would ever be so. I took it then handed it to Norman Schwarzkopf. And his reaction was can I keep it that's how much fun it was that but then.

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That was a there was a problem associated with that because it was drawn on the Morgan going to trust in New York this was Wednesday evening. And we wanted to get it deposits. Because there's a lot of interest yes I wanted $60000000.00 back of the my so we.

[00:51:08]
The comptroller for Central Command don't forge gosh the man took it down the next day Thursday morning the Saudi American bank and asked that the. It be electronically transfer and the banker told him You're not we have to have 760000000 similar bugs before we can do that and we don't have them so they came back and they found an Army captain that had been issued a Diner's Club card and they put him on a military jet to Paris and he used his military is donnish Club card and bought a ticket on this supersonic transport Concorde to New York.

[00:51:58]
And he arrived in New York Friday afternoon about 2 o'clock and they dipped they met him of course and deposited the check and saved interest over the weekend. Just Jassem. The He's the only military or civilian government employee ever to ride the supersonic transport to government expense of the small group that I had taken over there 7 Amish continued then to negotiate with the Saudis for the policies in part to establish the policies and procedures for the they.

[00:52:40]
For them to provide. The water transportation I keep repeating 5 spent a lot of money. And we developed we developed the policies and procedures that were followed then for the duration of Desert Storm and and that was about a $2400000000.00 negotiation as it turned out and they're still following those policies and procedures today in in Kuwait and in.

[00:53:16]
The Middle East throughout the Middle East they adopted those kind of. Policy is one we move into a system one of the nations in some manner standard. The. In December of 1900 the Kuwaitis had set up a task force in Washington d.c. and they were looking. To for support for the.

[00:53:48]
Reentry into Kuwait if you will and they came to the Corps of Engineers and because of my experience in Saudi I was able to meet with them and. Was able to tell them about our the engineer system its agreement in Saudi where we went in assisted the Saudis trained them accomplish their mission in a lab.

[00:54:14]
And that was very important to the Kuwaitis they didn't want somebody they would come in and out there forever. And so back to 2nd to January 1901 we signed an agreement with the Kuwaitis. To provide similar support to them and it turns out and most people don't realize this that.

[00:54:42]
The Kuwaiti government in exile was in Saudi Arabia we mobilized a group of from the Corps of Engineers. That went over to Saudi Arabia actually bought the trucks the vehicles and the radio was to move the Kuwaiti government in exile up the coast to Kuwait City as soon as it was liberated and and we accomplished that and then assisted the Kuwaitis in restoring their national infrastructure not to or will feel 5 fires everybody remembers the oil fields fires and that's the key but we assisted in in rebuilding bridges and in.

[00:55:36]
Getting their electrical and. Salt water to the song as a sion plants back in that service. And it was during that period I was in Washington and working with the. Politicians in Washington that I determined that it really wasn't much fun anymore it was time very time all you're going to do is get with the pilot distance for a little while and then on the right again a lot of exactly and you had put in a lot of years 3034 but any time you are in there you had to and I couldn't stay for one more year.

[00:56:15]
General Officers can retire and after 35 years. Everybody else has to retire at 30 if they want to but they don't have to stay that was that truck that's right so it was $991.00 and you decide to go for retirement. How did Georgia Tech come into your mind I had had a.

[00:56:41]
West Point classmate looser c.e.o.. I was a researcher for g t r. And and he sent me an announcement where Georgia Tech was looking for an associate vice president for facilities and. He said you might be interested in this so I'm very serendipitous sitting down look at it just popped out very serendipitous and not just popped up but thanks to Lou I don't know if it were loose Cicero or c. hell or or serendipitous but they're pretty close there it worked out well so you thought this could be I thought that is going to be something interesting and then you get a little bit.

[00:57:33]
Addictive by that time I've been working on some very large programs for for a long time in and I thought this is an opportunity to do something that doesn't come along right but it was significant it was interesting. And it was going to be a gradual come down from his excellent.

[00:57:56]
Vice president after an Enron to his i Phone Have you ever been to Georgia Tech before it's ever been to the campus I had only driven through Atlanta one time one time so you didn't even know physically what it was like Had you ever heard of it to have heard heard of it but but remember direct friendly right and so you one called a war letter went well I.

[00:58:22]
Sent my resume to Tim Gilmore. Who was at the time Dr Crew signs assistant. And they asked to come down to interview so they cause a foreigner and and so baby and I came down for an interview just one short war story with that is that 2 years before that before I'd gone to Heidelberg.

[00:58:48]
The chief of Engineers had called and asked me to go to Vicksburg Mississippi. To head up the lower Mississippi Valley Division of the Corps of Engineers and so I went home and told Bambi I said that that is one of the most desirable jobs a Corvette Janiero officer can have as be responsible for the for the lower Mississippi I went home to Ben being told or that general high bird wanted us to go to Vicksburg.

[00:59:20]
And she said if you do it will be an unaccompanied tour. I think she was going to ****. So we. Won and they asked me to come to Atlanta for the interview I told her you got to go to the ladder with me if you like I didn't know how she would she would like it we both were raised in West Tennessee and take a line we.

[00:59:48]
Had determined really that we wanted to retiring in Colorado or the northeast somewhere and so this was going to be a very changed playing plan was to make well. We came down and Gilmore had arranged for lease. To take Bamby around at that time Lee was selling into selling real estate.

[01:00:18]
At any rate we stay down here and that afternoon we got on the plane went back to Washington Bambi never said a word and. They. After we've been back to Washington for about a week are we going to have him go more needed an answer they had offered me the job Akin I say here wait for her to say that I was waiting for her to say such and then and she finally said I can like Atlanta and so Lee had shown her.

[01:00:54]
And make him an part. The better Virginia neighbor and we ended up in midtown which was great and and and they had lunch at Murphy's You know what I think that was by the prefix I think didn't like it Murphy's was a cellar that market Yes And so you accepted the job so we accepted the job and I was to retire from the Army the 1st of July 991 and I actually came down.

[01:01:27]
And went to work on the 1st of June 1901 I was on terminally you think yourself on a lot of time off that might not and. Then want to work in planning. For the construction associated with the with the hosting then left again because by this time of course we knew we had yes and it comes so you know it's the work in yes even you the logistics of all this whole.

[01:01:59]
Of what was to many people a fantasy about converting this campus into a village village you could see this happening that it was interesting and to. And at the time it was a big challenge. And I hold different way of playing a game than what you were used to and it was and what it really was and that's one of the keys to.

[01:02:25]
To our success I think in pulling that off. In that. Both Dr Gilmore it and pack resign. Thought that we should and in Russia Chamar thought that we should form a. Some sort of organization to oversee the construction summative the Georgian war Congress or authority that would have would have the power to award contracts and older say contractor to make the decisions as opposed to using the state agencies and it would still not the sea between state it but we did and that was what what I I thought I told him I said it would take longer to develop the infrastructure for now Thora to them will be for us to get the stake they really did to follow you realize that was that because of your military experience Well I've been working in the bureaucracy for 4 months 34 years so it could apply to your ocracy didn't bother me and it ended up that we followed all the state procedures for all of the construction and we were were successful in that now how did the miller come a well built.

[01:03:53]
Came back from from Saudi Arabia and. Was assigned to the Corps office in Atlanta and he was to retire in January 19th 919292 he says Georgia Tech on and wanted to stay in. The area and wanted to be part of Georgia Tech. Just like everybody of high school had you known him he and I worked together during Desert Storm and afterward so you have to touch and and we kept in touch here and so I called and.

[01:04:40]
Hired him and paid him starvation wages I don't I don't I don't know why ever seemed to work for us but that way speaking of the day he said Yes let me get it down. He came in and then I was the director of the I think planning and and that that was better by that time.

[01:05:05]
When I started off and in June I was only concerned with the facilities only concern with my friends and those facilities was the name by the fall of the 1991 it became obvious that there was a lot more to take hosting the Olympic village than the construction and there was no person on the faculty that was managing that process and.

[01:05:41]
I was able to convince them go more that we we really needed somebody to assist in managing the entire process. How at the time if you recall the they were planning to have. The campus it moved to West Georgia. So you had to had to consider moving the campus all the courses to 2 West Georgia all the all of the one play like that never would so 1st plan plan everything and.

[01:06:21]
Dine Giddens who is now on the Provost was head of aerospace engineering and he had done a great job heading a committee on pic planning and they laid the ground rules and we we by and large followed the plan that done good and laid out in 1009. With his committee the.

[01:06:48]
We didn't move to West Georgia but it was kind of a discovery that George was that it was month to month to month things were changing things changed and really in retrospect very quickly it didn't seem like it at the time but when you think about it seemed to happen pretty fast it was happening very fast and then it was happening in a lot of fronts that was a very the word tumultuous comes to mind on the right hand they begin with the last exam Well we tried to make it happen that but better than now but there was so many facts we were having a meeting every Monday morning with Dr Chris on rice Chandler and and we we do this very frustrating because we go into those meetings and we we discuss a problem and then you go back the next week and you could have played a tape of the 1st meeting and it would have been the same.

[01:07:48]
And so the thing that I think that that the thing that we did that was that gave us the best. Posture to to finish the UK to host the Olympics. I was we organized a tiered structure so that we had the planning group we had 3 tiers we had the the the planning group and those were the workers from each department and each of the components if you will the things that had to happen.

[01:08:29]
And and they met every week then above that we had the vice presidents and deans met and Kim Gilmore chaired that until last year and then I began to run and that was the senior adviser event. And then above that we had the executive review group with the president chairing it and.

[01:09:00]
We had a lot of people there turn a general that they an 80 Fraiser from the from the Olympic Committee that was a very high level group you had the influence or. People from the city land it's a political issue exactly so you had to be working with them again and we had that but we tried to look to let the planners initial lower group the people who actually had to do the work to do or leave them alone and let them plan that that activities that they had to plan and then the senior advisory group met monthly and so at the war group had decisions that they had to make that they couldn't make then the senior advisory group took them on and and if there were decisions that just saying your advisor a group couldn't make them we would take them to the executive review group on a quarterly basis so rather than Dr crease on the end involved on a weekly basis and trying to make all the decisions that every level we essentially.

[01:10:17]
Was welling to step back in and only be involved on a quarterly basis and human and when you record and he was agreeable and and through that structure we were able. To get decisions made and get the right people and Bob in and complete the planning but there ever a time when you didn't think it was going to happen now and we know when to well that was a given it had to have it had to have time after time without it had to happen and so it was a it was a given that that it was going to happen and are successful is was dependent on how well we planned it now that the when I 1st arrived.

[01:11:07]
Terry sic had had planned the dormitories. And an institution in and actually the graduate living center over 110th was under construction. And the graduate living center was was built with. An apartment stylus with 4 students in a room. The undergraduate living center was under design and I guess my greatest contribution to the lefties came at that time because they had planned the undergraduate living center to be.

[01:11:51]
What we know I mean call a 2 plus 2. Dormitory and that is 2 students to a room to room sharing a bat and. The 1st meeting I went to I asked one line. They were treating undergraduates different than the graduates and they said well they tear things up and I said wait a minute that that's not right and we can't we can expect for subscription to these dorms unless we build them correctly because they have to last a lot and I said we really should build on just like we're building the graduate living center for 4 students each student has a private room for the study area and a kitchen and that's the model that we should do as well the undergraduate living center was well under design.

[01:12:58]
And so we had then had to go to Dr Cree sign and make a presentation. And people said they're 1718 year old secretary things up and it's not going to work and I said Listen guys I've just spent 34 years for 1718 year olds with guns yes I said you've got to trust them and treat them like adults and they'll act like adults and that is I think pay dividends on a 1000 times all the time they were being the residents they were saying no I will not now never thought I might Congressman Mike honest was one of the biggest detractors say you to say we'll never fill those things and now for waiting like Georgia State was the same way and this surely we started out building the Georgia state dorms and the plan was that they'd be Georgia State Dorrance but for Georgia state never really bought into they want to commit to they do more numb because they wanted their go arms downtown and they race came well never Fillmore never and from the 1st year they've been fully subscribed in it's been a real success although in a way to write down all the residents.

[01:14:17]
And and it's amazing and I often think back if we had if we had built 2 plus 2 going Tory. It would have been a disaster and that kids are going to get more and more sophisticated they have better off and more looking for competition with the local market and the and you know those dorms over there moving the students out has changed midtown completely and it really is like a maverick Terry gone round where he would talk to anybody anywhere anytime and give tours to say we're starting to build them up and out pitching pitching pitching about the great advantage of the residents and he was so right well the 1st year before then life picks.

[01:15:03]
We. Leased. One of the dorms to Terry God bless at least one of the dorms today to the Atlanta art. To yes Islamic College of Art College of Art and they literally trashed the building. And we didn't find out about it until. The students had moved out in June he couldn't hold them accountable lympics we're we're 5 weeks away from taking control of the campus and that's probably the toughest part of the toughest part of the.

[01:15:49]
Whole thing worth was the time the queen the graduation in in 1996 and then epics taking over the campus it was tough What do you think about that time when you look back do you still think it was a good experience It was a great experience great reading No no we met met some great people and.

[01:16:17]
During the course of the activities the construction was important and it was it was interesting to see had some decisions and hard head are made but I think that in the real world. You know you learn what the ivory tower was. With we initially had planned to go to West Georgia Well the professors hadn't agreed to go to West Jordan they were going to West Georgia and people said but it's just you know down the highway when I start just down the highway to long way from 70 my gorgeous down.

[01:16:54]
And so then I started looking for a alternative and Southern tech went like a good alternative. But but that didn't turn out well because they couldn't accommodate some of our courses we went out to Southern tech and we're going to have to put in. Tents and different things and by the time by that time we had started wiring buildings for 4 for the network and we couldn't have afforded we could've afforded and then that's when I came back and recommended and said look we've got to have the summer session on campus and in doing some research I found that the summer quarter head had actually been a short is 9 weeks some years before that so you were having press that we weren't setting precedents we actually went to 8 weeks we cut some off the fall quarter and had the summer quarter on campus after the Olympics and that once we made that decision then it was alive everybody had the direction to go and it could have been done better you know we could have done some things differently but I'm not sure that that we could have hosted those games in any other way the biggest fear as of just you know somebody on the campus living through it without being involved in it as intensely as you were the biggest It was safety when was it going to be safe.

[01:18:44]
Because of course the Nazi things that happened before how did you feel when you. See why I probably had a different idea and that is. I knew what we knew what the. The Department of Defense for is responsible for security at the Olympic village they were and they knew them and I knew them and and and I really.

[01:19:12]
Became upset with the army for hadn't a soldier. On arm sitting about every 100 feet around the thins and I thought you know what a waste of soldiers times to to do this that just sit and and all day long. Securing the Olympic Village but. They also had a tremendous command center with the with all of the.

[01:19:45]
They the cameras available and they say that they or I'm street sewer that runs right through the campus. I've never walked in warm streets sure but I've been able to just to see it because of the cameras. And the command center where he went to curate.