An oral history interview with o ws Simmons, class of 1940 conducted by Maryland's summers on July the 22nd, 1998. We are at Mr. Sullivan's home on lake Joe taco and Jonesboro, Georgia. Mr. Simmons, Thank you so much for allowing us to come and visit with you today. We're looking forward to hearing your story and about your memories of Georgia Tech. 

Well, I appreciate you coming out and having me to tell my story. 

And to start off, we have our Z, a middle child of Shelton, May and salmons are born and the net Alabama in 1919. And we moved by. That had been in the text of business men in the Carolinas and o pellagra, Alabama. And we came to East Point, Georgia in 1928. 

So the early part of your life was in Alabama then areola part of my life was in Alabama grade school up through the fourth grade and then I started in East Point, Georgia in the fifth grade and graduated from Russell High School in these bonds. Before I went to take in my childhood, I say we have a five of us in the family. We had four boys and one girl. 

And I always use the expression to defend myself that I called it coming up and going their child syndrome, middle child syndrome. Remember those days is happy days. I remember a happy day, as I can tell you, a little happy experience. We will live in up in the Carolinas and we will come in to visit. My grandparents, lived in West Point, Georgia, and we had an open touring car. And you can imagine two people with five children and open touring car. And my father used to always have an expression over there. Then. Be careful we're going to see some bad animals over there. And we were hot in the summer town Raising Kane and data. We had about enough. Oh, and he said, Y'all better behave yourself back there. They're going to be for elephants and five lines on the other side of the mountain. 

Lo and behold, we crossed the top of the mountain and the circus, what's coming up the street to the town too. They didn't never did make an expression about any elephants coming to get us anymore. Surprise. Really a surprise. Him and my grandfather. One over hours name Paul's name for both of my grandfathers. 

Walton came from my mother's father and I used to love to go down there and visit with him than at West Point, Georgia. And he was like all grandfathers loving their grandchildren. 

And he taught me a lot special about hunting and fishing and are always enjoyed going down there with them. My father in 1929. And we're really in 28 when we move to use Point Georgia. This was the time, but the country began to come into the depression that we know. 

And my father had left as superintendent of a mill down and open like Alabama and he started a chemical beingness see started out with Southern the sizing company and it would furnishing textbook chemicals to the textile industry. And what did your daddy guys experienced? 

That ahead is experienced. 

Daddy attended Georgia Tech and textile engineering and ones that have been, he was in the class of 1910. I had an article that was in that class, nine teen 15. And he was John Simmons. 

And at the time of I remember him I'll call John was head of the bleacher in dye works down in Alabama. 

So it was a family tradition, dominant tradition. The two brothers had been in the textbook. 

And that you ever bought a, had an experience in always like to use the expression, we will all pull but then none of us know it. 

But dad went to the bank and having to be the CNS Bank of Atlanta. And he borrowed a thousand dollars to start a chemical manner. And he was a little bit really worried about whether he would get the loan. 

He went to the main one morning and that afternoon, the Mica called him up and told him maybe you'd be glad to. 

Lenin allowed mother and he started Southern silent company, but just a 1000 thousand dollars lower than he'd had several AutoCAD hair that he knew that he could come up with to do this when creating a product, sizing that the cardiac sizing and use it and then they go on finished clothes or did it go On fabric? 

Know. We started. 

You familiar with the texts to lenders day about how you card and the cotinine and you spin it and then you leave it. What a wave it, you have a warp yarn. 

And as cottonwoods back in those days and unlock it yesterday over there, the growing season, the cottonwood have different widths in it when you spun it out and it had to be a smooth surface to go through that wall. The weaving taking place because it would get a lot and it had to be sized. The warp had to walk was the one who had decided and coming in. And you used a lot of starch in it. And then we provided the lubricant for really. 

So that's it made, it prepared the fabric for prayer, for the next step, for the weaving step, and then that was typically the basis of the business. We did a lot of things. We did a lot of experience. As I say, I ended up working with them over then. I remember one time back in our possession. 

Don't ask me why we did this, but we were concerned about blue jeans and the color coming out of the blue gene. 

So we will go on to invent a product that we could permanent limb, keep those blue jeans blue. And the way we came about it, we decided if we latex, It's coming in about them. 

If we could late tax code that yarn and get it in there, then we would stop it from bleeding. 

Now, lo and behold, we didn't know that the product that would sell would be the faded blue day. 

But we did helped start out and that's the way you came out to the rich blue again by the latex going on and what would a lot of fun. 

But getting back to that is child, um, my childhood and that is text of business. He was successful in this business. 

So where did he start Southern Northern and Southern sign-in company and we lived in East Point, Georgia, but he started out in Atlanta, Georgia. 

So he established the firm, the firm in Atlanta, Georgia and boy in a very precarious time, per curious time, and it was tough, but my oldest brother no, it had my oldest brother went through ME and reversed and was a surgeon down West Point, Georgia. I'm a sister who was a second child. She went to business school and she worked with southern sky, then company secretary. 

So daddy was managing. Everybody was coming here, vita was coming along and I went to tag. 

Where did you go to high school? 

When I go to high school and went to Russell High School, need ****. The big school. The big school. And did Russell have eight through 11th grade? 

No. 12th? 

Uh, and when we went to prayer, he did have a full set of four schools, didn't. 

But I was born on August the 31st. 

And then when I was six years old when I started just googling September, and I got out a Russell High School and a class of 36 at the age of 16. When I what did you do? 

Skip grades. 

You go on through so fast matter where you start from six and you go I went to ten grade, then I went to my math must be slipping up on mail and it sounds like you got out of school early ahead of yourself then. 

Well, because you see, I mean, a lot of times today if you have a child at six years old in September, you didn't hold them out a year. Maybe you've met five years, so maybe you started with five here. God could have many. And that through. Hello Heather yourself, ahead of myself. 

But let's start. 

Now, you were the middle child, so you still had two younger brothers? 

Who had two younger brothers? 

And what was life like in Russell High School? 

Was that Jim good time to know that a lot of good times and bad music. What did you get involved? 

Well, I got involved in football and busted up my knees. I got interested in music and that wasn't high school. I was in high school and I took up a trumpet and then Rodric and Miller was the teacher there. He also taught chemistry and I rang it. Maria and I got interested in chemistry and more and more with my father being in it. And then Rodric in Mela, heaven man, the ban and July and Jordan. Yeah. 

Oh yeah, we went on but in my senior year, Russell over there, the base run, my graduate hadn't graduated and we didn't have abated rum. 

So I said I can play that thing and I picked up the bass drum and started and never did play my trumpet again. 

You just did it without any lessons or anything and whatever Roderick and melatonin, ma'am, and he was good at I might just add a natural talents. And my mother was music and she went to Lagrange college. And I didn't hear parents were well-educated, right. 

Did they raise you to think that you would always go to college? 

I mean, did you know that was a given unit that was understood in the family they might well at all. When did you start thinking about gold detach? 

Well, in my youth or low flying. And exposed to find Lindbergh. Lindbergh, I saw the Spirit of St. Louis when he came. He was your hero then how do you ever get tomato? 

No, never led me. 

I am but I knew Doug Davis and BVA blebbing down a canula feel it we add not too far from each point there, which is now heartfelt airport. And I saw I saw heart feel echo grow from just a race track to just a young boy. You knew you'd like to fly the chance to pan. When did you ever get a chance? 

Well, it was I hadn't really had gone with my wife. Boy, you didn't get a little more. I did not get to fly. 

But you knew you love to do it. I didn't know that I loved it. 

But my father, he couldn't see flying and he didn't he didn't much encouraged me to get into in a flying and it was in Russell High School. I had heard a lot about stumped at Thompson at Georgia Tech. 

I don't know whether you remember stump at town, but he was a great natural football player and he was through my associates and then withdraw at Duke in Milan, my father, chemistry started to study chemistry and go to jail or detached. He just knew it was going to happen. And now there's knew it wasn't going to happen. 

And in 1936 when I graduated, applied at tech and was accepted and say we would ask coming out of the depression at that time and your dad mesh keep the business. 

He managed to keep on keeping the business own and he had built it up to where we had a oh, well, we weren't rich, but we had a normal good life and had a lot of friends and east point and College Park. 

When we were old enough to start to school, there was one boy, James Fowler, James, his dad, it was a weld. 

And James had picked up well-done and he wanted to go to tech too, but he'd saved up enough money to buy I know for automobile. And that Ford automobile was our transportation from each bond. The Georgia Tech every day and you work commuter. 36, right? 

James Fowler and James followers. 

And we can muted There were times that back in that day, Miss dark ride, who was head of Georgia Power Company is we know what? 

He started a trellis system in Atlanta and we had streetcars it for $0.10. 

You could ride the school and it was but you didn't have to if you had a car, we had a call princely on the campus with a car because not too many people had cars, did they? 

Not too many red cards. You could find a parking place out there not too far from the machine shop. We would park it their own and stay all day. 

And do you remember the first time you went to tech? 

Was it when you started or had you ever been on the campus for the first time I went to was back in the day is when Newt Rockne and bought Notre Dame. And it was football game and it was very exciting. I mean, I'd say I was at that time about 14 year old. 

And I remember seeing a sign on was close to normal, normal story of now bigs and new was here and was talking about Newt Rockne in that interested me, my family. Nana, mine was very close friends with Dr. Britten and I hadn't known Dr. Britten to then add a new tech was the place to be. 

So it was cool. That was okay. Already been to a football game. And did you know when you came you were going to be a rat? 

No, I did. In a backward C, the ball is going around, wouldn't have read it. 

We used to have we used to have a lot of respect for that red head, but I hate to say it on all see that respect that down today and we did that. It's really a big deal and it was a big deal. The big deal enjoyed wearing years, so we're glad to have it. I had that bass drum and that ban over than ours insisted that everybody have that, read that. And of course back in that day we didn't of the big band that we have now. 

Now now, when you came to school for the very first time, did you know when you came you go get involved in the band and do every other one. We went into introduction and we got through with the school. We went down and then he introduced ourselves and made application to be in the band. 

So from the first it was part of your life, who is the director of the man at that time? 

Gearing and give it had been in Susan's ban. He was John Philip, John Philip Sousa, man. He was a most natural, talented musician that I've ever known. 

They, although my mother did, her mother's was in piano and voice and I wasn't patient enough to sit down and take the piano lesson. 

But sharing what I've learned in every piece of estimate that would be played in the band. 

So he could play all those things he could play or an estimate that was in there and he could be standing up and he could tell whether the second trumpet player, I missed the node or not. Top of his game. 

And I've been a whole the man was he at that time, was he an older gentleman? 

He was an older gentleman and he had been at Tech for quite awhile. I had minute tech. 

I don't know how many years did he was a band director that niche already musician there but for quite a while. 

To dry out for your position or did he just accept you when he came from Russell and he let the drunken Bella at Russell and look in melatonin media as a doc couldn't play the drum. 

So you were AS and so I went, I was in of course, hate this ILO mean, I hate to say it, but I I have dodge mini or Bhutan being thrown at me if I'm being a little early on an old or a little late or bring your own drum with you when you came on and they provide they provided the bass drum, but they provided the base wasn't a marching band in those days. It was a Martin man and we also had a concert man. And after football season, we had concert bands and we would travel about a little bit. Did you go for drills to learn how to do the marching on the field are hanging. Went for many a time and I hello, friends In the military and I had a lot of enemies. 

I remember one time, particularly we were having a drill and we won't have a big parade and we were going to have it on Greenfield and SAP and had disturbed me that morning and says I'm all fixed them. This was back in the days when we had the old wrap ligands that you wrapped around? 

Yeah. We were really hot. They couldn't have been very comfortable. No, they wouldn't be uncomfortable. 

But I'm I'll tell you a story where I made them more uncomfortable. Martin and our marching band on March it a 128 steps per minute. And that's the way you'd be kept the rhythm von. 

Well, I was a little bit upset about something. I don't remember what it was now, but that day instead of a 128, I had about a 140 step two minute. There wasn't a dry thread on that fear. Gang. Let me know about that to necessarily but he couldn't stop you up. He couldn't stop me out there because the every miner was passed in and then right. I could just picture this. They were all hyped right up here, hipped up, but he loved it and I loved it. We had a symphonic band that we practiced in afterwards, and he loved that type music too. In addition to the marching band. Did he teach you to play any of this to some music? 

Oh, yes. We hit all of them. We add all of them. And he was an unusual person in it. 

He not only wanted us to perform at our best, he wanted us to learn how to live with other people and get along with other people in the world. 

So you were getting philosophy, a lot of it back in that day under the E stands or we add the band room down on the bottom right next to the dressing rooms. And they own a little athletic room at the athlete's head. And we had to go by co-chair lexoffice. 

When we got there. 

Coachella was another person I'm proud and I came along at the time that I couldn't have known a person lack coat, hillock, Coachella was another one of these persons that he wanted you to know more about life than you did about playing football. And co-chair lignin know that football is you don't care at all. 

Now I'm talking about back in the 30s, football would catch on like it did and be a great demand for tickets. What coaches do with the tickets in AP care about, they care about it. 

But everybody's saying, Oh coach, I like them all get a ticket to go to the Tech football game, then call up Coachella One afternoon. I remember I had gone by then coach ethics office was open when he was talking on the telephone. See, we didn't have the communication system. He hadn't that old phone the head. 

And I could see his face was red and I knew the man somebody was kept in it on the other hand, but he was listening and it faith would write, read, and then a man and I heard him say, Well, I'll try. And any Slam of telephone down. He said the public they they're saying no, **** good. Today. I realized what he was talking about because I've seen some of the public since then. Somebody was putting pressure on him. 

But then to me being in a band every year, we would get up a little money to go on a football trip. And a lot of times you got a little Miami. It's due to manage their student? 

Yes, ma'am. We didn't how did you raise the money? 

Best way we could and we would beg, borrow and steal. Everybody had to go out and try to get a reminder, would have to go out and try to get it in. The band itself would get out and put on, thanks to raise money to Mecca football trail. And then we would be on the same train a lot of time with the football player that you would go on. 

And of course, we got to learn them in, and that's where new actin, how Kevin, all of the football players are that name. 

And they wouldn't want it little bit bigger frame than I was, and I quote, fit for them that a 140 steps a minute. 

But we learned that wherever we ran middle ear with it and have a good time to talking about times it takes. 

The football players have a lot of pressure on them to win-win-win, like they do today where a coach is going to play the game to the best of your ability. That's what was the motive thin and Grantland Rice had it, right? 

It might have not. Who want a loss, but how well did you play the game they wanted to keep? 

That was a motivation. If they don't win, the coach is going to lose his job. I mean, the part well, that's true too and that wrong way. It was fun. 

And I hate to see all of the pressure coming on these young boys and little league that way because you need to learn it. You see the football player didn't even have their own dormitory. They lived around just like we did. 

You find your own place delay on your own, don't my own camp at TV on campus, but you would just a student. And we had, we had a lot of fun. 

Now, the band had its own paternity, right? 

You started your upper cap as I was. And what was the point of that? 

Was that man, my encouragement for good bands, I'm sure. Is it because of gangs association with John Philip Sousa that We had a lot of interests in it. 

It take it that time and we still alive at that time or had he already passed on? 

I believe Susan had passed on. He'd already past time. 

So in a way, Gary was like an extension of him, that it wasn't extension and gang was never a rich person. 

I'm in his only income was what he got from take for the ban their tech, and he had no outside and musical association Eddie was associated with other than Andrea fraternite. 

Can you remember how many people were in the band? 

Approximately just didn't round numbers and we like were there 50 of you are normally we ever got to 50. Something bad to say about Florida. Maybe they kind of small. It was small and I got to know everybody. Oh, you knew everybody in the man, the young that you were talking about when we came in here. Matter of fact, he was kept in the band, one band. And everybody got to know everybody. Everybody knew everybody else. And we have all had a good time. Mr. Simons, school academics, were they challenging? 

All they were very challenged. And high school. 

We had general course that you would take in high school or you would take what we referred to a classical course, which were more background. 

If you are thinking about going to college and classical cause hours in and my band teacher or a Duke in Malawi as the chemistry professor there and I had him for chemistry. 

Remember, a math teacher? 

We had there that he was a great discipline there and as well as on it could leave an impression on young people. 

He had the strongest index finger of anybody I've ever known because the way he would get after he'd come up behind you and puppy in the head and you felt it for two or three day. 

But he did leave me with a great impression on mathematics and loved it. And so our wreck in the chemistry, the science background, and the math background, I hit me it. 

So when you got there and he started classes, you felt okay? 

I felt okay except I had to tote that drawn bow and we hadn't done drawing board and T-square that she had to carry with you all along. 

And that was the biggest thing because in that little automobile that we were commuting back and forth to school and you had was about three of us were Ryan and they've gotten a little bit awkward. I think about three days a week we had to have that drawing board. How did you like the drawing class? 

I loved it. 

Matter of fact, was a little bit SAR and down and out when quit having that role on board, it didn't teach the norm like they used to cause we didn't have the computers back in there. 

But maybe we did give a little bit to society and starting to computer. Maybe I remember I had, I had a high school arithmetic teacher. And I can remember the first day that I was in his class. And he would have on the board two times, two equals four. And he would say young people, I'd rather know that. Then I had to have my degree from Emory University and that's where he graduated from. And he made the impression, but he always told us when. 

You're thinking about numbers, if somebody mentioned for, if you can think about six, you will know how these machines run in the future. 

Now this was in 1935 that he told that story. That's the way computers run the day. 

I think these girls here, this curve here were way ahead of his curve and then made an impression on me. And I was lucky enough when our tech that had a math under Dr. Smith, I'll tell us your impressions of DMs Smith. Great teacher, highly learned man. And then I can repeat a couple of stories about Dr. Smith that maybe you do not have not heard, but Dr. Smith had about every degree from that you could get in mathematics, except one. And the only way that he could get this degree was go to Germany. 

Well, Dr. Smith didn't have the money to go to nerve. 

And then back in that time and group of business people in Atlanta took up the money and finally got enough for him to go to Germany to get that degree that he did not hate. And so in the summer time he went to Germany and he walked into the college. Forgotten now the name of the college. 

But he walked in and made his registration to get this degree and they handed them a book. And he took the book and flip through the pages. 

And they told him, he said Now when you know everything in that book, you can come back and take the domination for the degree. 

Well, he flipped over to the last page and close the book and hand it in the book back to the professor and said, I'm ready to take the examination. 

And he said, What You mean? 

You flip through that book like that and you're ready to take the examination now? 

He says Yes, I sure am. He said How can you do that? 

He says I'm the author of the book. We always thought that was a good story. I remember one day in their can't forget the student's name, but I think it was Johns Center. 

And he was by the time we break for Christmas and John was sitting up on as it was on the second floor and Administration bill in the here and now called hadn't been in the classrooms and dance alone now. 

But John was looking out the window and I can hear Dr. Smith to stay in. He popped his hands and got his attention and he said John, about ten years from now. 

So you're going to be out on a job and you're going to come across a math problem that you can't work, you, Sam, alright, and Dr. 

Smith and ask him how to work this problem and says I'm all get that letter and said I'm only send you an answer and I'm all right Back to you, John. I explained that problem and day you are sitting there looking out the window. 

But he left a lot of impressions on us and he was a good man, a good man, and he wasn't good man and he liked people and he liked young people and goods. And yes, right. He was great. And then Dr. Taylor and chemistry. Always a lot of times I'd be in lab and we had a lot of lay on back in the day. 

Seemed like to me it would on Monday, Wednesday, and Friday when we had layout, then it was a three-hour job. 

And you'd come up on a problem in chemistry over there and tailor their seemed interested in making sure that you not only knew how to work that problem, but you knew the Pretzel Bell behind and wide work. And he spent a lot of time with us, man. 

Here's our say we commuted most of the time that Dan lot of time we will have to set my clock getting home at night, but it was well worth the education that we got at it. 

But you still had to do your homework? 

Yes. We always had a homework to hand in over there. And when you go into school six days of the week then no no waiting. Waiting when we went to half a day on say I'm half a day on Saturday. Did that? 

Yeah, we had to say, but there are other professors come to mind. Lower they do come about, but how about you and Dean Skiles had men scarves and and sue. My family has knowledge of Dr. Brittain. 

I hadn't known the guy that and before you came to school, and I believe I got in differential equations, I believe was in math and I had a conversation with needs guy out and according nice guy would one of the first persons that I ever come across it at a hearing aid. 

They accept that time he had outside battery that set up on his desk and he could he could turn the volume up and down. It is convenience and he straightened me out in my math, but then I was noun in physics. 

And what my junior year and I get and I had another session with knee in Scotland and a session with deans girls were not necessarily exactly where God was. 

When you were having problems, you began up to talk to him, where you would put into it to solve that problem. 

At that time, I think I had failed physics course for the second time and that was when I had my competence with nice guy. And we hadn't had known in any normal family over there. I had to stay out of semester without having had to bring that thing up and out and like there. And I'm cool with all of their food is coming along. And third nine and beginning to be followed in. The war was in Europe in like fine. And now it's getting about all and maybe I can make my own decision about flying. 

And me and another friend of mine went down to the US Army recruiting office and no Didn't they live? 

I made an application for. Can be a cadet over at Montgomery. Flight or flight training. 

So it did Dean scholars know you did that? 

I didn't tell him about it. He was you butt heads with him in that way. 

We butted heads and scar or rare, rare, familiar with button here because here he butted heads with a lot of us. Have a lot of experience. You had a lot of experience and instrumental and having to make a big decision had fried. I made that bad decision and I went down and I was accepted in babies and could dip program. Did you go back and tell him? 

Oh, you didn't go back? 

I mean, family method made me do that. I had I've had to do their handle that. He understood and he was very understanding. I mean, he could be stern, but he couldn't be polite. 

And he could be polite with young people, but he was a southern gentleman and he was he was that he was at I'd been a lot of stores out about Dean Scott has been that I'm sure that everybody has heard all stored back in that day and probably still is today. 

Look at the person next day or one hour, you won't be here next semester and all of that, you know, we have a lot of famous for that, but it's the attorney who's hearing aid off and turn it into DNA and down where he wouldn't have to listen to the full excuse that he probably knew what you're going to say before we said it. Why you get pretty used, those kinds of things and leave an impression on him. 

But how about highest admiration of the nice guy? 

He was great. Instruct, a great professor at that time. 

Did you ever come across Dean Griffin? 

Was he Dean Griffin then? 

I don't think anybody has ever been detected, didn't come across name Griffin. 

So did you have your time with him? 

I had lots of fun with Dean Griffin and Dean Griffin, like they're Ribot and he liked gearing and he would come around and my band, and I remember one time I humbly named Griffin Leon than one. The domain is the one right on the corner there across from the stadium. 

And I stopped by that one day the sim or when he opened the door and they looked at Simmons, what in the devil do you want? 

But then he could lift. He was the greatest lesson of the more he had a real able to add. He was excellent at edited and he would make you feel, make you feel like it. You will go answer that question for yourself, really? 

Dean Griffin, what great. We had a lot of fun, mundane grip. And what was your social life like in those days? 

So should lie. 

Well, I was a member of the Methodist Church in east point and this was about the time that I met Josephine and began to it that time too, when I was taking the time out from Tech and I went to work with my father in southern sizing company and did a lot of the chemical analysis. Was this before you went into service? 

But yeah, I ran eight when I left tag. 

When you were in school though, did you go today the dances or play for any of the dances or take part in any of the Harlem I'm all alone. One committed. It helped pick the band. We got already shoulder come to one. Sam. 

Did you go to the dance that I didn't do a lot of Nantes and all of them, but I went to two or three the dances that we had, a big ones, really big one. 

So you can hear me and we could hear the big bands about the varsity or the theaters or anything like that. 

Did you ever give any of those swing the forest? 

We had the yellow jacket now, y'all don't remember the yellow jacket today like we did, but the yellow jacket was on the opposite side of the campus. And mac kept. Times got a little better. The Depression went on and we begin to accumulate a little outside money over there. 

We could not have to make that lunch up every morning when we laughed and said, Well, if we could either go to the bar, steer the yellow jacket, and we had a lot of good oxide activity from both of those places. 

We always would sit up and listen to the stories about trying to think of the man named now that headed up the yellow bars, right? 

Gordon. Gordon. We could lift the Frank story as a battle. He entertained with stories. Oh yeah. 

I mean, when he first met your where he wouldn't mind telling you about that time? 

It could've been dean and scarves and told him that he wasn't going to make it at Georgia Tech. 

Him walk across the street about piece of property and probably educated more young people in their day then hit about in Atlanta, Georgia. Did he needed from that over there? 

Yeah. We we would always we had a data anything that we need to go to the Barstow. 

So the students really supported Frank Gordy. 

Well, then uncoated frank go to real-world and as I said, there's no telling how many students Frank got educated at Georgia Tech. 

When you say educated, What do you mean help pay their way or just told them stories? 

He did a lot of good. Did he really did money? 

Lots again within the money. 

So he would lot of people talk about people in Atlanta hit it, made money. 

But through my work in the banking system and after I got out of the Southern sign-in company, The moneyed people of Atlanta I think, handle their money extra week because I shared it with other people. 

So they were very, very charitable, very rare charitable people. And I've never heard anyone say about Mr. Gordy, good Southern gentleman. 

If we want to put it that way, we educated a lot of Yankee. I thought the student got into trouble. That was a good place to place to go. Yet your problems saw it was a good place and a lot of time when we would go to eat. 

You could you had an hour or two before your next place you could get in a lot of studying up there, we would do. 

So you could actually study at the varsity, all the racket and everything going on. 

In involving that bother you were trained to do when you go to Georgia Tech did one thing that you got the hair. What's that determination? 

Stick with it. Stick with it. 

Did you ever go to the tech world theater? 

That was the tech would theater? 

Yes, we went to the tape, would see in those days, remember lower layers and then coarsely built the shrine building and the Fox Theater. They came over me, you wouldn't pick up a little extra money. I shouldn't have done it something up there. Oh, they did let you hired some texts? 

Oh, yeah. 

Did you ever do any jobs while you were in school? 

I was lucky enough that I had all for it when southern side of the company and when my father and I could do it that way. 

So you didn't have to pick up, but I knew a lot of people in the know. 

So the time came when you're going to take a little time off from school and took a little time out and I went down and it was accepted the little education, education, and work there for a while. 

And because I had to wait until molten and came in for me to get in there as a cadet and L4 and then fall down when the war would begin to pick up a little bit over that they decided that they had too many people sitting around and not being subject to the draft should be in the service. And so they decided that they would call all of us. We had many accepted as cadets in and they send us all to Miami. Wow, wow. 

I don't know, but it wasn't your dad feel about you going off like that? 

Did he approve of it? 

Dead would be interested in what was happening in the world at that time. 

And he understood all of brother hadn't graduated in Madison from Emory and he went directly into the service at that time, Nicola for an hour. I mean, he is in a fall, would be concerned about children going off to war. We had coming on, yes, he was concerned about it, but he didn't he didn't believe in fine. And you have to be a fibroblast, right? 

And but before the store gets over Dataflow a lot. Did he where are you in the ROTC when you were at Tech in the band or bad man ROTC. 

So you had some some military training or training. 

And here you find yourself down in Miami, done in Miami, and found out what a first sergeant was? 

No, a lot of people got together then a lot more as he came down and from New York, New Jersey away and know how to shine shoes. I used to pick up a lot of the money. You're making a shine on the hue down at night over there, Whether it pass inspection the next day. 

But you can go along in the army at that time and not get cold? 

No, I slipped out and went somewhere and by the way, I'd already gotten mad. You have to tell you them unintelligible. Still a baby boy. Goodness. Wow. Yeah, I couldn't even get my own application to get mad. I had to get my sister down that ordinary office to get Department to get mad. 

But we didn't have an IT problem. We now have 2020 years old, so can be 21. 

And so I may add Josephine and went right on this thing in my life I've ever done what man Don't feign. I'll tell you that. She got to Miami with you? 

No, she didn't get to go to Miami. We remember she came to a lot of other places. I was stationed there. 

But tricky I had when I got cows Lebanon down there there. 

Have you ever seen the lobby or some of those hotel down then seemed a little bit at tile that they got in there. 

He ought to be sentenced to clean those tile with a toothbrush and makes you want to quit getting current leaving. 

But after that was over, they sent us up to High Point, North Carolina. 

That when we went up there and they give us and make sure that everybody had the same basic education background. And the professors who are a little bit showed up there. And that's when I became the physics professor. My roommate, mosaic. He met me University of Pennsylvania and he was English professor. And you're told me he literally taught me that we did it for three months. He taught class. You just went back to your tech memory what I had to matter of fact, got my books at her hair. That helped out a lot. We all gotten by and after we left 0.5, after three months, we went to aviation school in Montgomery, Alabama and you finally got a chance to fly. 

Now we got a chance to fly. 

When I was up in High Point, the army had somebody that connection with the AFL up there and they had a couple of Piper Cubs up and we all got to flour paprika, my bear. With me on brand assets. You hold this up suddenly. Yeah. 

Well, that's what we put on our way to fly those piper cub. We're then then in flying a oil yeah. Big time where you back in that day. 

And then we went to Montgomery and went through the basic training that we hadn't Montgomery and then I was assigned down to Albany, Georgia for primary training. 

And about that time you will really have you had just been married and that idea and your wife was pregnant and you knew your first baby was going to be here. She got to come down to Albany, Georgia when our first child, dawn and Jamboard. John was born in 1943, believer. You had your family man? 

I have a family man. And then I went to basic training in Greenwood, Mississippi. 

That was the old basic trainer that we hear I know of yet I had a sergeant there, there was in charge of the line and the basic train. 

And he said, You know, when I retire, Miss Ahmad said I'm more by me wanting to make a trainer and hire somebody to crank it up at 430 of them on and yet, well, I feel natural. What was that when they'd have to warm them up to have them all ready for the next day. 

Now don't want to Columbus, Mississippi and advanced training twin engine. And that's where my friend Howard act and are connected backup into service. We both went to the advanced training in base in twin engine airplane in Columbus, Mississippi. Read waited there. 

The B26 mama was the bomber that had been accepted and made on a drawing board and never was a primary model of it and made the test it out. It would just made from the drawing. 

But it was a a good airplane and Howard and I both made application to go there and we both went to Dodge City, Kansas and beef sandwich six transition. 

And then the war was getting towards an end or when Europe and stepped out of the Bombay door one day up in a twisted my left knee, one of the old football neither that gotten in high school and I had a knee operation and how it went on down to the 826 transition and Howard was ready to go overseas. Again. 

He had been overseas in the infantry before we went into flying training and I was in the hospital and had my knee operated on. 

And when I got back out the wall when Europe was about o and I went down to Laredo, Texas and they used the B26 to tow the targets for the gunners and Obama's training on. 

And I was assigned down to Laredo, Texas toe and one of those and tell everybody below that did get a shot. 

One day we were flying and two, on a target and there was a B24 that was the gunners were flying on it. And there was observer, he was a captain, it was in Abella turn and he had been fine on our target. 

And we will fly along and we had dropped back a little bit for the tail gunner, the shoot on a target and my copilot in asset Walton at Bella turn is tracking us about debt, around a fit Caliban ammunition came in the cockpit, matter of fact, get busted. 

The co-pilot cable like, Oh, when that happened, I just turned over one shot down and call it kept him. 

How were you born? 

In India was when he realized that he couldn't my copilot control were gone and mine was still good. 

And so we came on in Atlanta and over then it can actually bend, not seeing him but he had a seizure and would probably going back, he'd been in combat and all the innocent. It gave you a worse to Mr. Simmons after your war adventure, a little escapade. How much longer were you in a service? 

What happened? 

I got out of the service. You have going back and forth. Already had VE Day and we're already hit B. They are down Laredo. 

Laredo, Texas doesn't mean no one of them makes appearances that idea there when I was in the service, I was off to the day in Laredo, Texas. The day the war ended in Japan. Of course, this was very exciting for military people and we had for time that way. 

I'll never forget I had a colonel Scott that was in command of the base down and I was also the day in court he came down and we had a great celebration at Laredo or may have based on that day celebration or everybody. 

I mean, we just opened up the base and let everybody read off all of the feelings that they had and not a party and a lot of partying went on and but we we survive that. And I had a reit industry experience. Colonel Scott was given a a job to go over the United States. They helped pick up a gunnery school at the Air Force might have when the war was over. And I'm lucky enough to be as pilot. 

Flying around all over, kind of had a great, great travel all over the United States to old army, were loving this line, the idea, and I still do. 

But after the war was over and I would tell you this little story that a lot of times and especially when the weather was bad and the flight room, we had a lot of bridge games going on and on. 

I was in the middle of a bridge game down now that mountain over then the telephone rang, they kept and got up. Man answered the phone and then he put the phone away. The answer, does anybody want to get that discharge today? 

And I had a good hand and bread. I mean, it was a good one and I was going rid of better Slam. 

But I'll put it down and I said me. And that was about one o'clock in the afternoon. It's six theta that night out on train coming home. Med quick. 

I got out rid of real quick and go back to your family, came back to East Point and we had had three children by that 43, John was enfolded three, and then we were in Dodge City, Kansas in late fall to four. 

And Bob got on the way and I had to send Josephine back home and didn't get the beat here when Bob would Milan was still in the service there and that was the second bar. 

And then when I got out of the arm and down on Laredo and he came home and I went back to southern side of the company and began to work in with my fault than the chemical business should have gone back to take man but kinda regretted it. 

But the knowledge that I received and the contacts I received, the tech, we're good to me back doing the arm and because when I was in the service and the people who found that I went to Georgia Tech, I never did. It hit it always helped me. 

And not from the background because the advertisement of the football, but because of the widespread notion of tech is a learning institution. And it always helped me and I should have gone back but I didn't. And I went to work in nafta. I'd been working about the children web two years apart. Bill would mourn. John. 

And I would like to say this as I told you, the best thing I ever did in lab when Marion Josephine, Josephine and I made up our mind when we had children, will grow up without children and with each one of them. 

And they would let a teacher compare children when they were in school because each one of them was an individual. And John was a young man when my father, he like everybody else and that AD smoked in ATI and two. And in 1953, my father was diagnosed with lung cancer. A bell Hopkins who had gone to high school. My brother was one of the first surgeons. They began to talk about cigarettes. 

And I can I was closer to my father than the other brothers and sisters and I would with my father in St. Joseph, Hospital. 

Data woke up and he asked Bill Hopkins what's going in there with the intention of trying to take out that one long. 

But he couldn't because it counts. I had already gone across his throat and was fixing to get up in the brain. And bill, that S builds it will build what we're going to do. And he told her what was wrong and operated, but he couldn't take out anything. And dad had looked at bill and said Bill that cigarettes have anything to do with their bill. Looked at my data. He says, Ms. Simmons, I know you want to move. It had 99 nine hundred one hundred per cent to do it. I had a back-up camels and my pocket now throwing them in the garbage can and not hospital. And I hadn't had one sense. 

Well, that was a significant experience. Is I say significant to me because I hadn't smoked cigarettes into them. We're going to lose your dad, but that's right. 

And this wasn't trying time to Little John and he made up his mind then at that age did he would go instead of Madison and he did give him a little background experience over there. He went live in down here and Joan burn, women living down here for far less for a year. 

But he graduated here in our graduate hand, Jonesboro. 

This was about the time that integration was coming in our educational system and we were concerned, matter of fact, there bottom was beginning wrong or where the private school in, but we did not believe in public schools and believing in them today. And John was a junior in high school. 

But he took an examination and he transferred from a junior year at Emory at Oxford. And he went to Emory at Oxford for one year. And he had a lot of admiration for tech called Hollywood actor had been made jam prevalent. They are in charge of their Athletic Association and not that tech and John had gone out there. How had gotten me to help him. It didn't grant field into football games and cold. We got the children jobs out there. And John wanted to go to tag. 

Now you want to have a real problem over there. Try to annotate without a high school diploma and see how much trouble you run into. 

But we finally got the acceptance from a letter from memory at Oxford. And John went to taking stead in biology. And at the end of his 30, yeah, he was accepted as a med student in Augusta. 

And he went to Augusta and went in family practice and practice and family medicine in Spartan Berg, South Carolina for. 

Well, he had been up in Spark Berg ever since, but he practiced medicine with about 20 years and then he was medical director at the hospital for five years. 

And now he's with a group of three different hospitals up and Carolinas, trying to help solve them medical problems that we have in our society today. And Bob was I had a lot from his dad. 

By the way, when I was in southern side and coming in, we begin to spread out and call on the paper industry for different chemicals. 

I kept a little skyline airplane and where we could fly around for an unsettling because of paper meals were scattered about. 

And paper mill will real good that the airplane industry or whether it always have an airstrip right next time and you could flow with a gate and buzz them and they wouldn't send a call out to their strip, pick you up when he came in and comedy it was there that was very accommodating and flying was, by the way, my dad before he died though, he finally learned to fly him and him the first time my dad had to learn to fly. 

But he learned it. Flying was a good thing for you, scaring me. 

But the reason they did, he saw an advertisement in one day where for $2.5, they would ensure his life for $50 thousand on a flight from atlanta, Dallas, Texas. 

Well, he said now they can be bad with that over than he thought and he loved it and he flew a lot of time for that. 

But Bob loved flying. 

And he wanted to because you were taking him flying from the time he shook them in that Scotland round, I met up care my whole family around in it. 

But Bobby, he really loved it. 

And matter of fact, Josephine always used to say that she couldn't keep a pen and a half because it have blue on it where Bob had been making model airplane. 

And he graduated from Joan bar high school and he went to Tech, graduating and taking aeronautical engineering and went to work wouldn't beach graph and which is now Raytheon Corporation and he'd been working on a new Git for them, their debt fiction to come out with and it'll be this year, I was saying. And it's been a priority important to him. And he he still flies and I go at the end, fly with them another time. He's a Wichita, Kansas and he has boy and a girl. The girl has already graduated from Kansas University and the boys junior at Oklahoma State. And then we had little Bill. 

And Bill took a lot of the personality and I think of his mother and never met a stranger and is alive. 

And he struggled in high school, but he got out of high school and then he went down to South Georgia College and went down there for a year. And then he went over to West George Carlin and graduated in bed net. And he was in the Navy and was a helicopter pilot and a navy if SEC hears. 

And they had a little boy that little bored and lacking when it did and went off on a cruise and Bill was walking down the streets of Jacksonville, gone into stockbrokers office applying for jobs and Dean would offer them a job. 

He got out of the Navy and went to work with Nain wetter and I was a stockbroker for two years and then he went into management and he would manage mountains Savannah, and then he was up in Atlanta for awhile and then he went to New York and was in charge of the training of stockbrokers for neon would up there and 04 years or three years ago, the chief executive officer wanted some neighborhood of people to work with the Discover people because they had merged. And three years ago he was transferred. Chicago would discover card and charging the merchants up. His son. We'll just graduated from university of Pennsylvania. Wharton School has been done pretty well. I think I think Georgia Tech his hip, the Simons family tremendously. They felt that hey, oh wow, hold on. Railway. 

Now let's go back to southern sizing. That's where you worked for 2525 years and how different capacities. When I lived back in that day when the textile mill began to merge together that become big. 

The first step that they would take would deform a chemical company and that new continent and they would do their own, oh, well, there was a lot of chemicals to be used in the paper industry at that time. And we begin to expand out in the paper industry. 

First hairpin them to control the phone when you take the file tree fibers and you're breaking them down over that, get them into paper. 

You have a tremendous phone problem and just to give you a good idea, but if you can get a little kerosene to float on the top of that thing away. 

You could kill the phone down and we help emulsify the cast and the way he could get it in there without having a danger problem that you were working at research as well as saying, we're coming up with new concepts for the company. And it thrived. 

It did railway all and but the competition of coming back of these big cooperation, getting their own chemical, continental air, kinda didn't go too well with me and I had an opportunity to sell out and I did sell out. About that time in life, you begin to wonder about things about the future and what's going on. 

But did have an opportunity to sell and get out of it and took it. And I'd made in France and new bill Biden real well. 

And matter of fact, after I had sold out and we'd got everything kind of quiet down, Josephine, That took a trip to New York. 

And while I was gone, bill by and tried to get in touch with him when I come back, he did and he asked me did I want to go work with trust company. And I said, Well, I believe that'd be a good opportunity and you weren't ready to hang it up. Is too young. 

I mean, I still had a lot to do and I went to I went and talked to Bill and went to work wouldn't trust company and they want you to do for them? 

They wanted me to get it being the bank inside of it. 

And when you didn't have any business banking experience to do by hand, I handled a month and you didn't have thought but I did go down there. What do some training down and went out into the branch system. And you were a banker that I was a banker then. 

And how did you like that? 

I liked it because every client it would you would talk to would be about a different subject, all of them and not to say. You got a vast knowledge of all businesses in the area where we went in and I enjoyed it. I enjoyed it tremendously. 

So from being the president of a company and calling all the shots, you were buying power by it. 

When I retired, I was vice president SunTrust up in Lakewood and the brand worked yourself up to that point. That's pretty amazing. It was a good experience and I enjoyed it like being a baker. 

Thank one of the greatest things that happened to me if you want to put it that way of the people that I met one hour to determine thruster. Mr. Jim has sibling on the greatest men Atlanta they will put up. And then of course, I was working for Mr. Coca-Cola and it was great. No, Mr. Ward room. 

So you knew Mr. Mr. Woodruff? 

Great and life and even latter stages of his life, he was still active. 

I know we had one time he was a directed at West Point Manufacturing Company which was in the cotton bid. And the trust come there and we used to have a golf matches between the two companies. We would go down to West Point one year in play and come up here the next, Mr. Woodruff, we'll go with it. Yeah. You got to know him really. Well. Yeah. 

Now there's a legend. 

May have been one of the greatest experience and learning experiences for me of the people that I met with the trust company, he joined a great organization truly. 

In Atlanta, it's history, one of the greatest philanthropist who did more no trial, giving money away to riot and still doing it through he has Foundation. Still doing it. Yeah. From the grave. 

Where would atlanta be without them? 

It wouldn't be you probably know that better than I wouldn't be if it hadn't been putting out so much. You even mentioned that you were in a position as a banker to know that that was not uncommon. There were many citizens that gave, you know. Right. They may have had less means that Mr. Woodruff they gave with them. I know I had a friend one time it was very active in the Boys and Girls Club. He would just aborts club back in that day. 

But he was on a committed to help raise the funds for the boys club and they got a donation from a foundation called treble or something of that type. I forgotten exactly. It was Robert spelled backwards. 

So you see where he was often anonymous? 

It was a whole lot often. I'd always heard rumors that he was the secret man behind saving the Fox Theater. 

Shortage of money at the very end of the problem, he probably was stepped in and said, no, we've got to do something about it. Right? 

We would like to see more appears car. Was he a friendly man, a family man? 

Mind like Oh, some of the best stories I heard. You were friendly to be all all right. Yes, ma'am. 

So he treated you well? 

Yeah. 

Man, though he was important and aware of his importance, he still was very kind to everybody, but he was kind to everybody. What was it, Bowen, Mona Lisa by the side of the road and be a friend to man. He knew how to do it. He did. He did that even though he became a legend and he was aware of trying. And he was always a Southern gentleman. And there's a lot of them, the siblings. Another great feminine Atlanta. They, Mr. Woodruff, although he had no connection with Georgia Tech, was a great friend of Georgia Tech. Georgia Woodruff left. 

You're living in some of them dormitories at that because they recognize the brand vacation, right? 

Yeah. Right. And the development of the whole state, right? 

To their great credit. 

They could see the big picture, right? 

As you went through the banking business, did your tech experience help you there too? 

We used to have a lot of fun when I went to bank. 

The first is I'll say, you said that I really didn't know anything about the operation of banks. And this was before calculators didn't really come in. 

And the first time I went to work and they gave me and death now, now went down when my slide rule and I see a smile back down or where they are, where they are. 

But slide rule work pretty good for us. And we took a lot of ribbon, or you might say about the Georgia taking the slide rule. 

But we were also the first ones to have that little computer to calculate with two and I don't know, don't take good none are real impression on the backend business because I wasn't in the first one and how it ecto he ended up working for the Trust Company and then a villa Mitchell within the Trust gotten there. We had a lot of trust can be a lot of trust company people in SunTrust now, I have the tech backup. I haven't tech background. Is that sure it didn't hurt, that it didn't hurt. Then heard, um, would say this about take. Um, but my oldest boy had three boys. 

And here's all this boy, John went through tech and he got up knee, Went to work with an outfit, didn't made the meters for the power company, but he made a mistake and they're called they transferred him to Miami. And he was a young man and he didn't like Miami. 

And he had worked with Dean would a little bit when he had gone to tech in air and computers and he made an application and the dean would, and he became a stockbroker and is in Atlanta. And you can imagine 27 meal or dark Broca. 

Used computers since it's drama school days and he was going to work with a group of men who in their fifties, who didn't know anything about a computer and John did real well and it's still down railway L as a stockbroker and Me, John's middle boy. Todd, went through tech and when he got out, he worked with Sun Trust. I mean, Sun help, a company going around and hip in hospital to get more efficient in their use. And he did that for about two years and decided maybe a masters and might hit him. 

So he went to borrow the money. 

On his own from the government and went to University of Chicago and business major and he got out, he went to work with Delta Airlines and public relations. And he all time kept it in his mind. And he had seen some artists making homemade furniture in Chicago. 

And as it's traveling around with delta were there he began to look these people up across the country and he connected up with about 21 people who made handmade finish. And he opened up a mission store. He called it a mission house on Peachtree Street, selling handmade furniture. And then his first three months, he'd been there. He met his projection for six months and he's going to stay in that bin. 

Youngest boy and went through tech and he decided when he got out that he would like to get into the health benefits a little boy. 

And he went to Georgia State and got him in degree in a gets it here in August in health mandated with therapy if he in New York right now, I'm doing this internship working with one of the tobacco companies up and they had Jim employee to get straight. Mr. 

Simmons, as we go into this the wrap-up on this interview with you, it occurs to me we stopped you and I and talked about how many people from your family. 

And we have come up with the astounding number of four to 14143 generations that went to Georgia Tech. That's pretty remarkable. 

It further remark Berlin to in my straight family over there with the grandchildren and we hit their pay in Josephine an hour. I'll knock on wood, hope that we live alone for another two years. We were seeing all six of our grandchildren graduate from college. And they've been a blessing to all of us. As I said before over there, we and our children, we didn't try to ever compare them. We kept them all. 

They're all individually, different people and we encourage each one of them in them feel that they wanted to go in, hit them out there and get to the top in that field. And we hope we can be a little contribution to our grandchildren when all get out of college. 

How do you feel about your retirement amount? 

My retirement has somebody said one time long ago there that when they retire, they didn't realize whenever I had time to go to work. You find a lot of activity. 

You'll find a new trauma and life that you kinda have to live at home with Mother little bit better than you used to because she might have not kept house exactly like you want to do. 

You didn't, but we worked that out pretty well and I'll let her take care of the hand sign and not take care of the outside and that keep you busy? 

Keep me fairly busy and I have always kept my charity affiliation and taught Sunday school. Pay us 50 years. 

Yes, that's right, Mark and I've enjoyed their play golf and a member of a golf group at the spavin country club. We have a seniors association in which we have to limit it to 100 people because it's too big. We don't hire anybody to run it. We do it ourselves and we play golf two to three days a week and that time, so oh, yeah. It doesn't get hot on the golf course. 

But they've got water spots around and they always have somebody coming around with Little Ice and cool drank far, Yeah, and it helps that and I'm sure that in our actually we got about 110 and they are right now. That's the exercise that they get everything and that's all they get in. 

If we didn't have that group that would get together and play golf. And several times during the year, we might take a trip and play golf on two or three days at a time. And that keeps us busy keeping that going and movement and keep you moving about. And then always like to. See those grandchildren and see how they are working. And we do a lot of bids and with them and stay with us and we'll get a little bit. We traveled quite a bit and we've had a good time travelling about. We've been in all the 48 states of this country. I've been out over in Japan. I did that back when I would work in. 

But there's still some more in this country that I want to say. We want to say I could go out to the Tetons in a day and a year and go back out at them. I love that. 

And we keep valid bit in keeping up with our friends and in looking at the inquires of new things happening in our society to our children and grandchildren can't keep him right up on everything. I hope to when you'll look back, would you have changed anything? 

I don't think I would. I think the good Lord had men good Me and my wife. And despite going through the rigors of arthritis and there are many operations that we've had. 

I would say that we've had a good life and I don't believe I would've changed in the bank, done it the same way again, I'm going to do it the same way again. And as I said while ago, every individual in the world as a different individual. 

And let's hope that we can make a little contribution to helping them express individuality to the rest of society. And society had been good to something. We hear a lot of bad things, but the minimal good things happening in our society than he had bad. It meant more good people and bad people, right? 

Yes, ma'am. And you've met some wow. You have doesn't sound like I know you have met some of the real treasures of land, real hair. 

We have been fortunate, even though the depression was came and impacted your life in the middle section, you're late, you Atlanta was still a good place to grow up, a good community for you to have been raised. 

Now, thank Elana. They Elana is a great place to grow up. 

And as I say, a construction business going along and you take a small airplane and flower will the Atlanta area and one of the most beautiful cities in the country. And you've been over a lot of them would just quit cut down all our tree. We still got a lot of trees. 

And as I told you a while ago when you came in or whatever the lightening decided to hit one of my layers are no. 

Any other stories that you want to share with us has been very, very lucky, but blast, It's been a good or bad. The luck of the Good luck was finding the right mate. That's right, that's right. And how novel that helped out a whole lot. 

And it helps you to go to Georgia Tech right at the beginning to get that discipline, was it that you called it? 

Determination? 

Determination. 

Determination, and regardless of how rough the goal in mind and yet, don't ever let your mind change and stick with it. Your story has been an inspiration to us. Thanks so much for taking the time to talk to you all. I appreciate you all coming out. Good.