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>> It was the same as all other countries what was different about Liberia was the total incompetence of though. He was not he didn't have the slightest inkling of how to manage anything. And that should have been a signal to us that it was was not a good thing but since his ability to his willingness to support the United States in anything he wanted it was very hard for us to to put that aside.

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Roberts Field CIA CIA and tell a field voice for American ten a field. Tracking station for satellites. Transatlantic navigation station it was all there but we one thing I did that I thought would have been a little gestures I increase the rent that we were paying. The rent we were paying was so low I said this is ridiculous so at least we had crease the red but otherwise the whole issue of democracy was not on the table in those days.

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Just a follow up to that question. We knew the U.S. has a track record for preaching human right and for promoting and supporting the values of human rights to the world. From what you just stupid can one who rightly assume then that. The U.S. policy on need be Africa or what a country is when it comes to.

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Its interests will hear it for example you stated that even to some Your due had a track record for doing the wrong things but because he was a friend of the US saw the US supported him at the time. I didn't quite understand what you say again. See if I can rephrase the question from the response you just gave.

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Is it right for them to assume that even do. One me. We have a huge human rights records but if he's a friend of the US then he gets supported because he said at that time. A lot of African countries like ninety percent had the issue of lack of democracy and everything but that we're seeing a focus you support us on your government support as I may do at the time because some here who was a friend of the US and he cooperated with the US even though he had this of human rights abuses that.

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Well. As I said before we did not consider the Samuel dog government to be much different from all the others. They all had human rights abuses actually did Samuel dog government human rights record was not as bad as a lot of other countries for example he I mean in Uganda.

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This was so bad that we had no relations with them we couldn't even keep an embassy there so there was the various degrees but we did not see the same year the government's record on human rights was being that different from from the others. So we we had no grounds for really treating Liberia differently plus as you say the fact that we had such tremendous support from go this was an element in our thinking but I don't think we would have.

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Been negative toward DAW even without all of that support it was just part of the same pattern that we had in Africa now the U.S. was not going around Africa telling people you've got to change you've got to do this. We did not want to be accused of neo colonialism.

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I was talking to the president of the Congo. I'm a verb there are. In the. He said to me would Obama be good for Africa. I said be careful we white people we could say a lot of things to you users of a neo colonialist But Obama is going to be tough he can say things to you that.

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You're going to have to listen. So we did not want to to get into this business of telling Africans what to do. Later we got into that would even then we're very careful but in those days we just did not tell Africans what to do fact even on economic things we were so worried about.

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Telling Africans what to do that we found somebody else to do it we found a bad crop to go in there was the World Bank. The World Bank went in there and shook the Africans you got a change we were not doing that because we're going to sensitivity and that was the same thing with Liberia.

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And second question borders around comment of yours. During the time of the Liberian crisis. In September of one thousand nine hundred just after. Deliberating and Sonia too was captured and brutally killed by police Jonesy at a time in when Liberia was. In in a state of chaos and you were you rightly student you were working very hard behind the scene negotiating in between the various factions and speaking with the viewers players to end the war but then you also wanted US territory and some of us were actually interested to hear we were hiding I was a journalist at the time I was hiding with group of of reporters for fear of our lives in you we lived by DO WE DO YOU HAVE A transistor radio.

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And we live to listen to B.B.C. which we thought was more accurate in his news and also to what the Americans were saying about the war because at that time all of us where we're hopeful that the Americans will step in to do something about the war and there was a deft everywhere order around us people were completely hopeless and.

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After one of your meetings with with Mr Tudor you gave an interview over the B.B.C. and in that interview you stated that. Charles Taylor was a man that the United States go do business with. And I guess to come in border around fact you had. TO was already dead and no.

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Deal had the largest force or was ever but a comment was a bit of be disturbing were very frightening living into their territory and see a lot of the killers in all of the killings and everything so my question here is why did the U.S. because you were an official member of the U.S. government I did time in the midst of all of the chaos and everything that he was doing executing people all over the place why did the U.S. think that Hillary was the man to do business with at that time.

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While at that point we we believe that this was kind of the only solution. Our main concern was getting the war over with so if it meant dealing with Taylor We thought that was a good use that the best possible for the least bad. Arrangement that was all those we had no illusions about Taylor although he got a lot worse later after he became president.

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But the whole idea was to stop the war. My last question. President Jimmy Carter was also very instrumental in trying to to stop the Liberian war especially in the early days in this very distinct and he was back and forth you might be right. I do negotiate when Echo Mark was there and he was accused by you know sometimes other sites of like the US as having been biased towards a Mr Turner in one of the accusation center around the fact that in one thousand nine hundred in in one thousand and five.

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He. Met with Mr Taylor sure I to get him to agree to this too or go more in Agree for elections in one thousand nine hundred seventy and President Carter went to meet with Mr great idea it was covered by the international media and also by the when journalists who were briefing of.

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To go to Mr Taylor's territory. And. After President Carter left from greater Liberian came back to Liberia to meet with the interim government at the time he thought that Mr Taylor was ready to end the war and he had encourage the economic forces at the time to reduce discuss and show.

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Of soldiers that they had around to do buffer zone area of the border way to US territory in a coma in the interim government territory and. That advice was take into consideration the West African peacekeeping force reduce its forces from around here we are in. On it to know that you know who is actually preparing for war what we now refer to as the IT person.

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Ninety six war my question here is. You also deal with Mr extensively. Do you thing do you now feel from your from where you sit now. Do you think Mr Taylor actually deceived the United States. Well you spoke about what his promises to Carter Yes His promises to his promises was to Carter he'd be a couple of promises to the U.S. government he was going to decide he was going to go to elections in no none of these things have been.

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President Carter met with him in all honesty he encouraged him to allow to whisk peacekeeping troops to reduce their forces. He was going to disarm he was going to go to elections and right after that we went into for skilled Great Well I think my recollection is that Taylor signed many agreements.

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He went to Yemen grew up I think about eight times and each time he signed an agreement and none of them did he implement. So if he didn't implement those agreements his lying to Carter was part of the pattern he just did not trust echo Mog he felt they were out to get him and then his only solution was to get rid of economic and allow him to take over.

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Now what point did he finally given. President a Bacha from Nigeria had a conversation with him and for some miraculous reason Taylor accepted the solution. I'm sorry about just that I'd like to interview him and find out what his magic was to cause Taylor to finally agree to something but he failed to implement every agreement that he signed up until that point according Carter.

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Thank you excellences. For coming and for us the opportunity. To together explore the history of by your U.S. relationships and how those relationships have impacted mutually and we should. But. You in your presentation you try to. Give an outline of the longstanding ties between the U.S. and Liberia and perhaps I will try to let me just provide some further background.

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You recall that during the United States seventy seven constitutional convention. The issue of equality was raised whether the slaves. Like it where the time were to be considered equal to whites and it was unanimously agreed that that issue would be deferred for at least twenty years. I was seventy seven.

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In eating all eight seven we saw the creation of the United States Agency for what we captured Africans that eventually led Captain Robert Stockton later on became a congressman in the U.S.. About his ship the U.S.S. alligator that landed at the shores of an Royer. Pointing a pistol to the head of King George computer and others and force an agreement.

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To seat a portion of land that today is known as the Republic of Iberia. Further on we saw. In the As a matter of fact despite that. Recognition of Iberia did not come until about it in sixty five during the US the Civil War or the Liberia was a creation of a nice is interesting I says our policy.

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In eight hundred we saw the recruitment of thousands of Liberians to work in the at the for the building of the Panama Canal one of my great grand uncles a great great grandson course. As the story goes went well one of the recalled it would have been and I never never saw him again.

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Then of course in the one nine hundred eighty nine hundred seventeen at the behest. The United States library declared war against Germany and lost our relationship with major trading partner Germany and again in the 1940's one thing. Your library declared war against Germany in the Second World War.

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Through the sixty's. Liberia was the head of the CIA in Africa. During the Angolan Civil War Robert field was used for the lifting of arms do you need to and I have an early as my colleague said the casting the deciding vote for the creation of Israel was kept by direct support of the US So we have quite a long history.

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And our history is inextricably linked to yours and there so. Coming to a one thousand nine hundred eleven Civil War I recall when the war began. I was a record volunteer. Went to the front lines and. Some time there about in January. I had occasion to be coming over Richard Staley who was the U.S. military advisor.

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With the Lebanon troops on the frontline and there were all these reports of atrocities being committed by the Libyan army which was trained by U.S. military experts and being directed by U.S. military experts and. There were these reports that were coming in as he sat along with other Libyan commanders.

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Internet defense minister and he said What is that process were being committed. By the Libyan army as he rightly said like a scorched earth policy I was in a bunker we saw the massive looting and all of that and we did not hear a lot of protest by United States as to the conduct of you Liberian forces in containing the rebel incursion.

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This efficiently to really rapidly and the work of the records was interrupted. I briefly flatus early on but in one thousand in the same here September. I came back to do an assessment of the humanitarian situation and at the time like there was divided when we were publishing are doing those that were in a Thousand United States had ten ten to fifteen tons of food in a warehouse a movie star vision was everywhere.

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And better than jumpy to divorce if used by pleadings that this food be delivered to all. Like telling mother then pregnant women. But right at her bell there was food distribution going on so why was this policy of bias towards Taylor so many festal point that thousands of Liberians died as a result of such callous indifference three seconds an idea as the first question.

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And then of course we saw the presence of U.S. Marines the commune briefly put a cordon around the area back to the people living raise a lot of hopes that U.S. was going to intervene and suddenly vanished and for this continued during the period of the octopus there was still this this slant U.S. foreign policy slant towards Taylor as compared to the greater interest of Liberia.

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And. Of course during the door regime as my colleague said. Close to a billion dollars whatever it was provided to Liberian government merely. For the acquisition of military equipment so my question is. As a former official. Of the nicest government. Would you support. Those who. Hold the opinion that the nicest government does have a moral obligation to pay reparations or Liberia as a consequence of the destructive war as a consequence of the United States indifference to US edition we should it would have a right if.

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We share this opinion that you support those who make this call. I do not share that opinion. I think if you're looking for reparations you should go to booking a fossil in Cote d'Ivoire. The war would never have occurred if. Charles Taylor this man had not been trained in Libya sent to booking a facet where they were given all this equipment transported to Cote d'Ivoire.

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Where they were given vehicles to take them inside. Liberia to start the war it would never happen the United States did nothing to do it starting the war perhaps us conduct in failure to pursue peace vigorously is not grounds for reparations we could have done more but we had nothing to do with the war existing in taking place.

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But the king of Feisal Cote d'Ivoire are the ones who did it you should go there and say look why did you do it give us reparations these are the guilty people but does that does that interpreted mean that the US had no leverage with countries like I could walk and it was well known that Libya was training and Libya was a principal enemy of the US is at the time in Libya was providing support I'm sure coming from Libya.

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Does that suggest we saw sanctions against some of the countries. By the U.S. So are you suggesting that you have no leverage at all could you. And then end up with enough muscle to the point work that you. Protest even threaten sanctions are something that thing I know well I think we did make a mistake in not putting pressure on them at the time but we really didn't have that much leverage Cote d'Ivoire is essentially strongly related to France France was giving them aid France didn't give a damn about Liberia in fact when we talk to the French about putting pressure on the court you are they said it's an American problem.

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But here the same time France was operating and it is a huge major U.S. company and they're running millions of dollars in profit so correspondingly would you not think that that. There was some measure. Of. Some degree of obligation that he was there in this respect while obligation and you can argue that word but I think that the key people who all Liberia reparations are broken the facts on Cote d'Ivoire these are the ones United States perhaps didn't do a good job in trying to bring about the end of the war I will a good grade of that but that doesn't give the U.S. responsibility for paying reparations to the Liberian people.

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Spent quite a lot of money on that war I mean the both the Bush administration and the Clinton administration spent hundreds of millions of dollars for humanitarian assistance to help the Liberian people during that war was very the biggest anybody gave So there's been a lot of money paid by the U.S. taxpayer as a result of that war but in terms of.

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Of taking responsibility for all of the bad things that happened. It's broken if I so. Go there but do you think that such a huge amount of money that you say has been spent pale in comparison to. So what just about even said something the Marines were to the look at the up to the course don't you think such usual expense on our humanitarian aid would certainly appeal in comparison to a few thousand U.S. troops coming or going to stop in the war I'm sure in the destruction of infrastructure and human lives that these were these were errors which I think I would acknowledge should've not happen but that doesn't make us responsible for everything that happened all the bad things that happened in Liberia what we did not do.

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There's a lot of countries that bad things are happening where we do not intervene. All over the world including today. Kossovo today we're not intervening we're trying to get U.N. troops in there but we're not sending U.S. troops so you can say that the U.S. has obligations to pay reparations to Sudan's people because we're not intervening not intervening is not grounds for.

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Paying reparations intervening with the with the intent of course in trouble is grounds for reparations booking if I so called they were the ones who did that the moral responsibility don't you think the U.S. has a moral responsibility in this regard. I'm not sure I know the definition of that that thank you very much except.

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By agreeing to come to this commission. As to what the years or was do in a time of all conflict. And also tank you so much for everything you did and I wanted to stop. What hostility though it didn't help me. My question is I turned off follow up question as to what really happened in one thousand nine hundred eighty.

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It's a popular believe that doing one thing. It would not be impossible for the enlisted men took over two would have government. On what you just said that security advisor Ducktown me never came across any information as to do U.S. involvement in Liberia. Yet after yet after the coup there was increase the Liberian government had time.

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And then after that we notice or we saw ten days of saw the X. official of the God-Man were killed and proles relatives of the former president and who feel the government would deny entry to the U.S. Can you comment on that. I'm sorry I cannot collect because I was not involved with policy at that time I'm not trying to evade the question I just don't know what the policy considerations were.

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The only thing I can tell you is that the massacre at the time told me later that he was considered to be a popular the people of Liberia what happened at the time. That's the only thing I've learned but in terms of these decisions about aid and.