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>> Well it's good to be back to Atlanta I lived here for about seventeen years and I appreciate you bringing me back in also making sure this day would be so true beautiful spring day we're just emerging from winter in Washington it's nice to come to our I don't know there's much more to be said on what matter fairly soon but I'll start.

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With a moment twenty six years ago. December of one nine hundred seventy eight President Jimmy Carter asked me. A colleague in the State Department to go down to the banner to meet with the don't ask the first secret meeting that occurred between senior level U.S. officials and Fidel Castro since relations had been broken in one nine hundred sixty one.

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And he was loaded for bear he used those previous eighteen years I have to be ready for this moment and he unloaded on us in a massive exorcism wrong. Describing in full some detail on all of the terrible things that the United States had done to his country and to him over the previous eighteen years he started with the Church Committee report the Senate intelligence I sassed Nations he walked us through each of those assassinations and then said But that's only one third the Senate got it completely wrong let me tell you about the other two hundred attempted assassinations that the CIA was responsible for.

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But at the end of this warm discussions he pulled me aside and he pointed his finger as he is very good at doing at my chest instead. I know U.S. policy. I have people at the highest level of your government and they tell me what your policy you.

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You know who. Is to. Tell me. What policy is he said U.S. policy is to wait for me to die and I don't intend to cooperate. And you know that's still U.S. policy. And you know it's still Fidel Castro's policy. He still has no intention of cooperating when John Negroponte about four months ago while he was still in charge of all of the intelligence community of the United States I now.

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That the CIA and the intelligence community had definitive proof that Fidel Castro was about to die I knew that he would live. I knew that he would come back once again to torment me and one day I'd be about my good friend and all of the other people been waiting for him to pass away.

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And sure enough. He did not transfer authority or power if you read closely the actual live thirty first statement that Fidel Castro said I'm here the only gated function on the most provisional basis to as many fairly points out to eight people. Showing clearly that he is the only one indispensable you can get eight for the price of one as long as Fidel is there and because it's a provisional one.

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He left it in the hands of his brother Raul who understands very well and indeed has brought to new life the famous George Orwellian phrase Big Brother is watching you on the rubble knows that as long as be Dell is alive and breathing Big Brother is watching. And indeed there is not going to be any major changes there will be very subtle hints which might be fairly pointed out he made change your phrase that this statement may change but there is nothing as long as he's alive indeed I would predict the transition won't start until six months after he's dead after the fiftieth autopsy really does acknowledge that he really is dead then at that moment of the Cuban people all the way to and say.

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I guess he's really dead and gone and what do we do now. But if anybody expects that transition to occur on the moment of death whatever that may be and I don't think it will be soon. It will not occur there and that's basically what we've seen since one thirty first so.

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What does that tell us. It tells us that Cuba is stuck. But the truth is so is the United States. And the United States has been stuck. Somewhere are you throughout most of this century from the moment in which we invaded to liberate Cuba in eight hundred ninety eight in the Spanish-American War and to begin to escape.

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A century of isolationism on to this day some would say that we've been stuck since we don't Castro came to power forty seven years ago so since one nine hundred sixty one in January just before President Kennedy took office when we broke diplomatic relations but the truth is that we're stuck.

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And what have we gotten from our policy. The policy of the the policy of isolating Cuba has produced a communist Stalinist regime with cow D.-O. who is discarding. It's this great probably Sherry hero who opened his country to our most serious superpower competitor during the period of the Cold War installing Soviet missiles.

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And bringing the world to virtually the brink of catastrophe in October nineteenth sixty two indeed in one of my conversation with Fidel Castro back in one thousand nine hundred eighty right after the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan he told me for the first time he later confirmed twelve years later that he had been urging Khrushchev to launch missiles during the missile crisis because as he noted in his letter to Khrushchev the thing about these missiles is you have to use them first.

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Well of course Chris should have more sense then could you know and upon reading this letter decided he'd better stop first because maybe he did not have full control and he didn't because we also learned in our conference in one thousand nine hundred two. That the shooting down by the service here missiles of U two over Cuba was actually done by Fidel.

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They don't want to run to the Soviet batteries and be rated the Soviet general in charge of News saying that Cuba was defending itself human it was going to shoot every plane it could but it could only get up to this spot. To get up to you to say required a SAM missile and so therefore he made clear to the Russian that they needed to do it and sure enough the Russian listen if you don't because that's what you do on the island of Cuba and so we came very close to a nuclear holocaust.

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This is the product of a policy for which there's been very little. Flexibility very little. Imagination. There are and there are many different explanations for why we did normalize with you but it is true that Jimmy Carter wanted to in one nine hundred seventy seven and he took the first step towards establishing the interest sections in both our countries and despite everything Ronald Reagan and George Bush have said since then they have not closed those introspections they're still open as a measure of communication.

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But we fail and we feel. Perhaps because. Of the thesis in America was a statement that Cuba is an actor not just a victim and that Cuban didn't really want to do it but I don't think that's the real us and I also think we failed because Carter didn't have a second term and I also don't think we failed because of Mario actually we feel before that in the fall of one thousand nine hundred eight when I was making that trip down there we did give paedo a very clear choice and we said to him that any further expansion of your military presence in Africa would make normalization impossible he had a trade off and he chose.

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He preferred to fight in Ethiopia under the auspices of the Soviet general then to normalize relations with the United States. But we drew the wrong conclusion of that and so did so did. Bill Clinton for the wrong conclusion in the Ryssdal drawing the wrong conclusion of it is well.

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There's some people who think that we have not normalized because of Miami. Miami being not only made up of many Cuban Americans that are so angry with the devil the idea of normalization would turn would lead them to burn Miami or thorough. Down or maybe even take Jeb Bush's house away.

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On something quite that serious. The truth is that the Miami Cubans do sit at a pivotal political place in our national politics we saw that near Duval's and we seen that in in the fact that major U.S. policy to Cuba happens to be made in the fourth year.

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On a par quadrennial basis and usually just before the primary in Florence surely a coincidence that it's occurred I think that. Torricelli amendment which in one thousand nine hundred two in which Bill Clinton adopted a much more positive role than even George Bush Sr am. And then of course in one nine hundred ninety six with the homes burned many measurements in the shooting down of the plains and many times since then so human politics in Miami has played somewhat of an explanation but I think that's too narrow an explanation for why we have not moved towards normalization.

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I think it has to do with that the failure of Carter and Clinton more than it does with the Republican Party and that is that they and many of us had long believed that the important goal was scored ensure. There for this powerful bargaining chip Our should be put forward only if we get something for it.

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And he'd George Bush made some variation on that claim but the clearest statements were by Carter in a fact. In one thousand nine hundred eighty eight and Clinton throughout his whole administration there is a big problem with his bargaining chip power and that is that maybe Fidel Castro and the Cuban revolutionary regime don't really want to bargain on that ship maybe they know their interest better than we.

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No more interest and indeed in a conversation I had with Castro in one thousand nine hundred five when Helms Burton was was before the U.S. Congress he said to me you know you know I'm I'm guided moment very very rear of until then and not very rare since then I say.

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You know if you look at the embargo morrow we probably find a way to reimpose that the next day. He understands in a way that Americans don't know that lifting the embargo and moving towards normalization of relations and opening trade travel and having students be able to go back and forth and all over the place is in our interest not in his if you don't control a Stalinist state that's open.

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Openness is our advantage it's our history and his weakness. We haven't figured that out but he happens. And therefore to suggest to him that if you just allow free elections and step down and do all of the twenty two zero zero requirements. That are in Helms Burton before we will seriously negotiate with you he will naturally stand for the defense of the Cuban homeland because he doesn't want an openness open relationship.

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Stalinist regime relies on a fortress that relies on closure and being Fidel Castro who understands in a way we don't the power of propaganda the power of positioning yourself in negotiation he wants to appear it's the United States that's preventing openness preventing free trade preventing free trouble and being.

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States keeps obliging him by doing that so that's where we're caught. We have two options really in front of us. The two options I would describe as. Getting under his skin or getting into his shoes. The option of getting under his skin has been our policy we we feel really good certainly the politicians feel good if we figure out a way to really provoke him to behave like him.

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For the last six years under George Bush he's pretty good at this. Ranting and raving at people Orange Bowl stadium or a political rally in Miami we're going to be I'm going to be them the president that brings democracy to Cuba of course every president has said that but but Armstrong every is not good.

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And we're going to free the people for a few good people and we're going to bring free enterprise which will a race all racial differences just as it's done in the United States so successfully. This is and we're going to spend two hundred fifty million dollars which is what George Bush has spent since he's taken office to promote democracy and openness in Cuba that's what we've really spent most of it's spent on radio and T.V. Marti which is only seen in the studios in Miami right.

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That's what we're doing and you know the truth is that this does Bob this regime I mean they really think that we have the power to change by these various programs not realizing he's your crass report barrel programs its only purpose is to solidify the president's political base in Florida and to have the counterproductive effect in Cuba of making it very difficult for any opening for any.

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Space. X. the one option that's the action we've tried for forty seven years and the fact that it's film for forty seven years hasn't yet don't want to go on this great democracy of the United States the second option is to get in their shoes and to ask ourselves a different question instead of the question is how can we her to go how can we heard the regime how can we try to bring it down ask ourselves the question how do we have a large space for almost very courageous people in Cuba that want freedom.

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How do we make it easier for them rather than are. And the answer to that isn't is pretty straightforward. It's to open things to put the burden an obligation back on the bill to sit down to go sheet with them and to visit and talk with the dissidents and to have and to try to move in small steps that don't that are obviously provocative that can.

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Can be used repeatedly as excuses by the regime for locking these people who are now what will happen by this policy well you will see democracy break out overnight. You won't see human rights restored overnight in fact the most immediate steps will probably be more of a crack up.

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Precisely because they know the danger of openness and so we have to swallow that we have been too stupid that this is not going to lead to an immediate. Utopia there is no nothing will be. But in the long term it's the only strategy over time and frankly.

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It's better to do it now while the bell is still air or whatever your disability or by the time he comes back because Raul didn't have a point there are a fairly. Looted. And I think quite correctly pointed out in some ways to deal with us in a better position to manage this opening.

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I think of the opening occurs after Fidel it will in a very well lead to more chaos and if there is more chaos. And if there is violence are the pressures on the U.S. to intervene in Cuba will be HUGE go back and read the debate in the United States eighty ninety five to eighty ninety eight and see what the pressures were to go in there and to prevent the repression ravish against the Cuban revolution that's nothing as compared to what will happen if there is serious violence but if we do intervene in Cuba it will be a disaster it will make some people in astrology for Iraq.

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And it will also not only destroy our future relationship will destroy much of what's been able to be attained in Cuba as well so we need to protect ourselves even while we're protecting them against that eventuality that means that we need to start sooner not later. To open up now what's the prospect of us doing that.

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I could not do that as a person who's been in these wars now for thirty years and to watch even liberal Democrats turn around on a dime on the human issue for politics I'm optimistic that our body politic is going to except. The counterintuitive it requires tremendous political courage to do it on the counterintuitive set as we advance our interests by looking at Marvel normalizing relations without getting anything in return that's very hard to argue with.

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In the United States that requires somebody like Jimmy Carter. I'm kind of walking down a similar a similarly counterintuitive argument that we will have hands are believed to keep the towel in if we relax our control very hard argument to make it nineteen eighty and eighty one and explains the Carter Center's early opening.

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So I don't see a politician in the United States willing to walk up to this issue in quite a good way but there are possibilities some economic interests are interested in getting involved they certainly were interested with regard to agriculture. And there is a need on students parts if you paid go a leading role to be able to travel and study and open up and make it easier there are contrary needs to be community after all they are the ones who want to connect with their relatives more easily than has been possible under Bush so there is some possibility both and I think the first step requires a self-awareness that our country has not come to even a man as brilliant as Bill Clinton never figured this you know even to the last day he said I want to normalize I want to open up but they weren't willing to take the steps in terms of becoming more democratic that would probably be to do with the up.

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Of course they don't want to be more democratic. Of course that's not a core of being sure but we haven't quite reached that point so. To conclude there's a wonderful story of a of a peace for peace corps volunteer which I was one visiting a very remote village.

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Among the people the people thought that all Peace Corps volunteers at least where I was were punished for years as well. And sure enough. I found myself in the same position once read the palm of young boy and said you know young boys you're going to be poor.

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Distressed until you're forty. Away came very upset and said well what will happen after that had the piece from here said you'll get used to it. Well we're now forty seven and we've gotten used to a bad relationship with US Cuba but let's not get used to it any further Thank you.